EXPERIENCE 162 | Love to Appreciate and Let Go of the Rope with Diana Rogers Jaeger, author, speaker & leadership and employee retention expert.

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Diana Rogers Jagger joined me for an uplifting conversation a few weeks ago and shared her fascinating life and career journey that led her to Northern Colorado in 2022.

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Diana is the founder and owner of Love to Appreciate Consulting and recently released a new book, Let Go of the Rope, Create Unlimited Confidence.

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Love to Appreciate was founded in 2017 and is focused on helping companies keep their best and brightest.

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Initially, Diana was particularly focused on creating a work environment that millennials would be attracted to and wish to remain a part of.

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But over the seasons, she's developed her practice to be kind of a co creator.

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Cultural designer who helps companies design an integrated and appreciated workforce of all generations.

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Have a fascinating life story, beginning in the Philippines as the children of an American father and Filipino mother.

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As they were preparing to move to America, their father was murdered.

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And their mother was a prime suspect.

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The murder remains unsolved, and the children never saw their birth mother again.

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They departed the Philippines to move to America as a set of five, initially moving in with their aging grandparents, and eventually all being adopted into a previously childless family in the community, and living and learning a life of outdoor adventure and can do attitude from their adoptive parents.

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Diana is a dynamo, all the energy and smarts and wit that you could put into a five foot one package.

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And she shares abundantly from her topical expertise in appreciation and confidence cultivation.

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She's a great representative of one of Northern Colorado's strongest import markets.

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Smart, capable, and purpose driven individuals.

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Working hard to make their corner of the world a better place.

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So please enjoy, as I did, my conversation with Diana Rogers Jager.

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You bought the Lifetime Membership?

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Mm hm.

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Yep.

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During the 100th anniversary.

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I was not a Girl Scout growing up, but then I became an adult volunteer as a troop leader.

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OK.

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And then got in really deep.

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I guess so.

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I guess so.

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And then I committed, and I was pregnant.

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I was like, what happens if I don't have a girlfriend?

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a daughter.

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Like, well, I want to be a lifetime member.

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And I didn't know what I was having it.

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And I have two sons and I just had decided it doesn't matter.

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I will always give back.

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Cause I always want to help build girls of courage, confidence, and character.

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So it's like, it doesn't matter if I'll never be the troop leader for my own daughter.

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I will always find a way to bring this just a little closer.

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Okay.

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Um, well, We've already met Diana Rogers Jagger, and she's joined me in the podcast studios today at the Loco Experience to talk about her new book, her journey, things that she's most proud of, and her biggest failures, too.

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Alright.

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Are you ready to start with that?

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Let's do it all! So, Diana is the owner and founder of Love to Appreciate Consulting.

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Um, she moved here from Oklahoma about two years ago.

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Two years ago?

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That's right.

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And, uh, she recently completed a book.

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The book is called Create Unlimited Confidence in Three Simple Steps.

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And so, oh, is it Let Go of the Rope?

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Yes.

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That's the tagline?

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That's the main title.

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The subtitle is actually Create Unlimited Confidence in Three Simple Steps.

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Oh.

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The nugget of what the promise of the book is, is how to create unlimited confidence.

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Wow, let go of the rope seems like, I'm not going to be confident if I let go of the rope though.

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It's a metaphor.

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Oh.

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Related to rock climbing.

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So at the age of nine, I learned to rock climb for the first time.

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And I had seen, my father ran a camp in southern Colorado near Alamosa and Monta Vista.

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And there were usually high school, um, groups that would win.

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A lot of them were boys.

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And I just remember seeing these.

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You know, very athletic, muscular high school boys, rock climbing, and it looked like you needed a lot of upper body strength to do it.

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So I really had no confidence that I would be good at it.

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I was always the shortest, skinniest, um, in all my classes growing up.

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So I really didn't think it was for me.

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And then my father, who is a rock climbing instructor, you know, had us learn, my siblings and I, and so he coached me through it.

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And so what happens when you get on the Into your gear and you're ready to climb and you know, you're climbing maybe just like a foot up You want to basically like hold on to the rope.

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You think it's your Safety net right and it is but you actually can't climb.

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Yeah, it's not you holding on to it That's making it safe the fact that it's not So my father was like, you have to let go of the rope in order to climb.

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And so the goal was to climb up.

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And so that's the thing, right?

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You have to trust yourself, trust, um, my coach, who is my father, what he was saying that it's safe, and he actually had me climb about five feet off the ground and purposely let go.

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So I could feel what, you know, how it would catch me.

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Oh, right.

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Yeah.

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So then I could go up higher and not doubt that I was safe.

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Right.

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And so that's the confidence building part is feeling safe enough to let go.

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And that the great things happen when you get out of your comfort zone by letting go of that rope, and you have to do that in order to climb and get to your goal, which.

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You know, you want to get to the top.

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Well, you probably found out that being small was actually not a disadvantage in climbing.

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Exactly.

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And my dad coached me that it's actually all in your legs, right?

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You're really not pulling yourself up by your arms.

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You're finding footholds and toeholds, and you're using your legs to step up.

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And you use your arms to stay on the wall.

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Exactly.

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Exactly.

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More for balance.

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And so that, yes, I did actually, um, realize that being, um, You know, really skinny and not weighing very much less than a hundred pounds was actually a strength in rock climbing and Yeah, and it was, it taught me that taking risks is fun, right?

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Because after you get over the initial fear of, okay, I'm actually not going to die if I fall.

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I, you know, I am doing a safe sport.

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Then it became fun because as you're climbing up, you're, you know, You're the only one who got yourself there.

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Like no one is pulling the rope up.

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Like you, if you, even if you don't make it to the top and you get halfway up and you look down, you're like, Whoa, this is really high.

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And I got myself here.

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And then getting to the top was even more exciting.

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And then also repelling, which is its own set of fears.

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When my dad was like, lean, you know, you're at the top, keep leaning back, leaning back, it should be perpendicular.

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And you're like, what?

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This does not seem right.

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But I, he coached me and I listened to what he.

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You know, he said, and it was true, like, I mean, that is the best position.

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You can basically walk down because then your legs are going to spring off that wall.

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Exactly.

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You know, it took me a long time to be able to, like, bounce down, you know, like the good people did.

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I was a little bit older, but it was an adventure and a risk that paid off.

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And I feel like that nugget of a lesson has served me well in my life.

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trying new, even starting my own business, right?

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It's like a risk.

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Um, but I also could see the fun and adventure in starting a new business.

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Well, one thing I wanted to mention we have in common is I was, uh, I was Kurt the squirt.

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Uh, when I got to seventh grade, I was I was four foot eleven and a hundred pounds, and at the end of tenth grade I was five foot one and a hundred and ten pounds.

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Wow.

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And then I got tall.

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Uh huh.

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And super skinny for a while, and now I'm, you know, bigger.

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The bourbon.

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But that doesn't matter.

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It's tequila.

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It's less calories than tequila.

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I think that's the weight loss characteristics.

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Is that what you tell yourself?

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Um, so, so anyway, I wanted to relate that and it was an interesting perspective, um, and you got quite a bit taller too, right?

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Yeah, I'm 5'1 Oh, is that all you are?

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Yes, I am.

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Well, you have big boots.

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Yes, I do tend to wear some heels or wedges, but at the age of nine, gosh, I mean, I was probably like 70 pounds or something like that.

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Yeah, I'm sure I was too.

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I was always the smallest kid in all my classes for many years.

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So tell me about, uh, we'll get into the book a little more, kind of the breakdown of what Where the idea came from and stuff.

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But I want to learn more about love to appreciate, like, what is your business?

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Who do you help?

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How do you help them?

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So I focus on as a consultant, speaker and trainer on employee engagement and retention, helping organizations keep their best and brightest people.

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And how I started my business is I was a millennial who worked at the same place for 12 years.

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Okay.

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Which is really unheard of because, you know, Millennials were nicknamed the job hopping generation.

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And so all my friends and peers are switching jobs over two or three years and I was there Was it because you were at a good place?

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Yes.

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Yes.

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Like you came to learn that through talking to your friends and stuff that were like, my place is lame or whatever?

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Yes.

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Um, toxic bosses, toxic workplaces.

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Um, so I, I already knew I was working at a great place, but then you hear those stories and it really solidified, you know, gosh.

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moving somewhere just to a different organization for, you know, slightly more compensation, like what you have to take in consideration, like the, to me, the entire compensation package, right?

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It's not just what you pay and the benefits, but will I enjoy the people I work with?

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Will I enjoy the work I do?

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Will I be treated well?

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Will I feel valued?

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You know, all of those things, does it have a mission that I get excited to support?

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And so when you take in I was, as a typical millennial, looking at the whole package before looking to switch organizations.

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And there was just enough, what I call, um, I planted deep roots that kept me there.

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Um, I worked in affordable housing, so I was able to make a difference in that way.

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And I, the people I worked with were like my work family, so.

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Tell me about starting Love to Appreciate.

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Like, did you get trained up in things, or was this just an itch that was trying to break out?

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Um, it was something I was.

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Um, I worked in public relations communications, that was my role, and I started taking on employee engagement.

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For example, we had core values that every few years we would review and see if you wanted to change them, and we'd put it in our annual report and on our website, but we never talked about it, and I just saw that as a missed opportunity.

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And so I started a core values recognition program, it was called FRITE, because the acronyms of our core values, yes, F R I T E.

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And so I started an Uh, Core Values Recognition Program, where People could nominate and share stories about how they caught someone being frightful and exhibiting some of those core values.

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And it really strengthened our culture because people felt good, right, being recognized for, um, exhibiting those core values.

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And then hearing the stories shared about other people made you feel good to work for the organization and to be associated and be friends with those people.

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Cause like, yeah.

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Wow.

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Like they are, you know, they're great people doing great things.

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And so, um, I wanted to spend, uh, I was a mom, a young, uh, recent mother, and I wanted more quality time with my children.

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So I wanted to start a business and I was given the advice.

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I told you to have more free time that way.

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I know, right.

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It's a mixed bag.

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Um, I, I wanted to be in control of my time.

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And so, um, um, I was given the advice to, right, solve a problem that people would be willing to pay you for.

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And so I knew that the recruitment and retention of millennials was very difficult for a lot of organizations.

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That we were, um, you know, growing in the, by numbers in the workforce.

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We were starting to take on leadership positions.

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And, um, the more and more of us were entering the workforce too.

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And so there was like that generation of workers and a lot of, you know, Old school minded, business owners, just having a job.

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Mr.

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Exactly.

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Appreciate you get a paycheck.

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Um, didn't understand us.

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And so I saw that as an opportunity to help solve their problems there in that, uh, you know, you, you worked for a place that had a culture already that you resonated with and felt empowered to like share this idea of the fight recognition program thing.

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Right.

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And then that allowed you to even have an impact on it.

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And I'm sure there's.

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Probably many other stories of your co workers, your peers, that also had a chance to get their ideas put into action.

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Yes, yes.

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Um, actually one of my co workers, um, she was the person who made fun one of our core values.

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And we were a government trust, and I was like, am I allowed to have fun?

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It's like, is this allowed?

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And so that says a lot right there, right?

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Having an organization that says, yes, we believe in having fun at work.

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And one of my favorite memories is it was one of the years of the summer Olympics, but scheduling an office Olympics and we had medals and like 12 events like real sporting things are like, well, like, like putting.

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Three or four office chairs together and you had to like, hook on to the next one and like, you know, walk really fast and race them.

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We had, um, paper clip, um, creating a chain the longest, like in two minutes.

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So there are different things, um, like paper airplane contests and things.

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Different things like that.

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But, um, people really got into it.

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You know, people like fun and competition and, you know, winning at something.

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And it really boosted morale and, um, yeah, and boosted relationships too, right?

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Because you're having fun together.

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So that's your core service, if you will, is, is Is it still Millennials, or are you adapting to all these, what do they call these, Z's?

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Gen Z's.

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Gen Z's coming in?

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Um, I'm adapted to all, and actually since COVID, the Millennials are really not getting as much attention anymore.

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It's just kind of now, today's workforce.

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The Millennials are easy compared to the It's like current workforce having a job you love and enjoying the people you work with and feeling valued and respected and treated like a human being that knows no generation like we all want to be that way.

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And I'm proud that it was my generation that started kind of setting the bar and expectations about like, if I'm going to work like it needs to meet these criteria because life doesn't listen back to this episode.

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They're gonna be like, dude, you gotta make some changes.

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Oh, and so, um, yeah, life's too short and there's not this wall between work life and personal life.

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It's just life.

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And so that's how people in the workforce today view it since COVID because, right.

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I mean, it just kind of reset our priorities.

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Um, so I would say like the generation piece is less important.

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It's just keeping the employees you have and attracting the ones you want.

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Creating that culture.

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I just had a three year.

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Lunch with Alma last Friday, actually.

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And so she got, she got a raise, you know, and well deserved.

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And, um, and I'm always like, man, I don't want her to go somewhere else.

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She's she's money in the bank.

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And, and.

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Um, she's like, Hey, you know, you're awfully flexible, you know, and, and what reminded me or of that conversation was at some point in the conversation, she's like, and like, I really think of you as a friend, you know, and that's pretty special.

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Um, yeah.

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So, you know, she knows she's appreciated all that kind of stuff, I think, as long as she works hard and.

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Yeah.

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Work hard, play hard.

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I mean, it's important to have, right?

00:16:51,514 --> 00:16:55,495
I mean, you have to be accountable in the workplace and do what you're paid to do.

00:16:55,524 --> 00:16:55,924
Yes.

00:16:55,934 --> 00:16:56,985
That is very important.

00:16:56,985 --> 00:16:58,095
Uh, is rewarded by flexibility.

00:16:58,144 --> 00:16:58,705
Exactly.

00:16:59,205 --> 00:17:01,264
Um, but there's also other things too, right?

00:17:01,264 --> 00:17:02,654
We're not just here for the paycheck.

00:17:02,664 --> 00:17:03,154
Correct.

00:17:03,414 --> 00:17:06,095
So talk to me about how do companies do this?

00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:06,960
Yeah.

00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:11,650
Like, like what's that, what are the tools, is it different for every company?

00:17:11,700 --> 00:17:16,690
I'm assuming that it has to be kind of custom fitted to the culture and what the company actually does?

00:17:16,769 --> 00:17:17,640
Exactly.

00:17:17,829 --> 00:17:29,200
So to me, it's less about what the company does though, but it's about who the people are who work in that organization and then aligning their wants and needs with the goals of the organization.

00:17:29,519 --> 00:17:34,789
So right, some companies have a huge, maybe their goal is to grow, right?

00:17:34,789 --> 00:17:34,849
Appreciate it.

00:17:34,910 --> 00:17:40,339
And, you know, in profits, or sometimes it's to grow in size, or maybe it's to acquire another business.

00:17:40,339 --> 00:17:40,890
All of the above.

00:17:40,930 --> 00:17:41,150
Yeah.

00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:44,859
And others, it's just to retain the people they have.

00:17:45,569 --> 00:17:48,869
And so, based, I'm a problem solver.

00:17:48,869 --> 00:17:50,099
That's how I see myself.

00:17:50,099 --> 00:18:02,829
And so I really like to go into an organization, understand what their goals are, what their challenges are, and then design, I'm a culture designer, design the culture and employee engagement, um, to fit that.

00:18:03,134 --> 00:18:06,065
and getting input from the people who work there.

00:18:06,234 --> 00:18:19,795
So, you know, in some organizations, like having a Friday happy hour every week is really important to them or having, um, that quality time together and to just like relax at the end of the week.

00:18:20,005 --> 00:18:26,065
And some other people, it's about more working remotely and maybe their parents and they just, and they need more flexibility.

00:18:26,164 --> 00:18:27,664
You gotta go pick up the kids, whatever.

00:18:27,664 --> 00:18:27,744
Exactly.

00:18:27,744 --> 00:18:31,335
So listening to the current employees and understanding.

00:18:31,755 --> 00:18:46,835
Like I said, their needs and desires, and then matching that with what the business goals are, because, and that's where the magic happens, because that's where the creativity comes and how are we going to design employee engagement program that aligns with everyone's needs?

00:18:46,884 --> 00:18:49,184
Yeah, that was the question I was going was.

00:18:49,845 --> 00:19:02,734
Are you, you're not really designing the culture per se, you're kind of affirming the culture, but supplementing it with systems or recognition things or things that, the culture is already kind of mostly there, or you want to change it sometimes too?

00:19:02,755 --> 00:19:10,795
Yes, so um, I'm about to um, have a client and they have a They didn't use the word toxic, but I will.

00:19:11,515 --> 00:19:17,384
They currently have a toxic culture because, um, there has been no intent behind their culture.

00:19:17,384 --> 00:19:26,545
And so now a few people, um, some managers have been treating people badly and leadership has let it happen.

00:19:26,744 --> 00:19:29,805
So then it's become the norm and become accepted.

00:19:30,204 --> 00:19:33,984
And people have been leaving, um, and complaining.

00:19:34,275 --> 00:19:36,714
And so now it's time to redesign the culture.

00:19:36,765 --> 00:19:36,984
Gotcha.

00:19:36,994 --> 00:19:37,265
Right.

00:19:37,295 --> 00:19:38,144
But it's not overnight.

00:19:38,144 --> 00:19:41,565
It's not just like I design it and it happens the next day.

00:19:42,065 --> 00:19:42,295
Yeah.

00:19:42,295 --> 00:19:46,065
So describe, if you would, like a normal engagement.

00:19:46,065 --> 00:19:54,819
Does that start with like, kind of a, And then it's like a kind of a long term engagement, maybe once a quarter for a while or something like that.

00:19:54,819 --> 00:19:55,345
Yes.

00:19:55,345 --> 00:19:55,704
Yeah.

00:19:55,704 --> 00:20:06,815
So it begins with the, the assessment and talking to leadership and to cohorts of different people in the organization, understanding the gap between where they are and where they want to be.

00:20:07,134 --> 00:20:09,474
And then I Kind of traditional strategic planning.

00:20:09,484 --> 00:20:09,515
Yes.

00:20:09,525 --> 00:20:09,605
Exactly.

00:20:09,605 --> 00:20:10,654
Like what is the current status?

00:20:10,674 --> 00:20:10,934
Yes.

00:20:10,954 --> 00:20:12,724
Yes, uh huh, right.

00:20:12,755 --> 00:20:24,664
And then taking that information and like I said, culture design or designing an employee engagement program so that, let's say, um, they want to increase appreciation and recognition.

00:20:24,664 --> 00:20:28,234
And so what, what, how do you build that into the culture?

00:20:28,234 --> 00:20:30,394
So it may start with training but doesn't, doesn't, doesn't really work.

00:20:30,924 --> 00:20:35,174
And with training, right, you have to figure a way to build it into the culture.

00:20:35,174 --> 00:20:40,055
For example, it, you know, appreciation is part of every meeting agenda, right?

00:20:40,075 --> 00:21:00,819
Maybe there's a committee called the A team for appreciation team that they're the champions of making it happen so that, um, the organization, if it's important to them, they're going to model those behaviors and make sure it's talked about at company meetings that they're, you know, There's visual signage in the organization that reminds people to do that.

00:21:01,049 --> 00:21:07,460
They're talking about it, um, and so, right, that's why I'm talking about the design because it has to be woven into the fabric.

00:21:07,460 --> 00:21:09,700
Some language around what they do and stuff like that.

00:21:09,700 --> 00:21:17,670
Yes, and it has to be intentional and, um, a huge rollout at the beginning so it sticks, but then you have to keep it going, right?

00:21:17,700 --> 00:21:29,710
Now, are you going, like, into, like, even some of the mission vision values kind of thing and like redoing some of that with the executive team at time inviting employee engagement.

00:21:29,710 --> 00:21:30,849
And what are our values?

00:21:30,849 --> 00:21:31,480
What are you seeing?

00:21:31,519 --> 00:21:32,089
Exactly.

00:21:32,619 --> 00:21:32,950
Yup.

00:21:33,150 --> 00:21:33,490
Yup.

00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,759
I do that too, because that is the foundation.

00:21:36,759 --> 00:21:47,950
So, I love core values and vision and mission because even if we're, we have different opinions and interests and we're just two different people, right, and there's, you know, a lot of individuals in our organization.

00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:57,380
If those can be the common bonds of, like I talked about, I used to work in affordable housing, like we're here to make sure that people have a safe, decent place to live.

00:21:57,380 --> 00:21:57,759
Yeah, yeah.

00:21:57,809 --> 00:22:01,630
Whether, um, and so if we can come around that.

00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:03,839
then we have a lot in common.

00:22:03,950 --> 00:22:13,529
And then again, with the core values, those are standards for, you know, the behaviors that we want to celebrate, um, and how we treat each other.

00:22:13,789 --> 00:22:28,950
And so, um, And I always talk about the behaviors that because right integrity because you can have words like honesty and integrity is your core values, but I always have the organization translated into well, what does that look like in the workplace?

00:22:29,289 --> 00:22:29,609
Right?

00:22:29,609 --> 00:22:35,319
And so putting it into everyday language like integrity means I'm going to do what I say I'm going to do.

00:22:35,460 --> 00:22:35,769
Right.

00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:40,440
I mean, that's more crystal clear about how we act than integrity.

00:22:40,890 --> 00:22:48,650
So I, I like the words are easy to remember, but then you have to build it out so that it's crystal clear to people about the behaviors.

00:22:48,980 --> 00:22:54,420
Um, you want people to exhibit and then that way you can also catch people doing the right thing.

00:22:54,500 --> 00:22:54,970
Right.

00:22:55,000 --> 00:23:03,769
And then if you have that core values recognition program, then everyone knows what to look for and everyone's modeling that to everyone else.

00:23:03,779 --> 00:23:04,589
Well, and I.

00:23:04,589 --> 00:23:15,750
I think I'm hearing a little bit of embracing of different ways of delivering on that mission, those values, because there's, you know, some people are really head down.

00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,589
Some people are very, you know, just different ways of being.

00:23:18,779 --> 00:23:19,240
Yes.

00:23:19,450 --> 00:23:19,829
Yeah.

00:23:20,009 --> 00:23:23,190
So, and some people take appreciation differently as well.

00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:34,329
Like I've had employees before that if I like wrote a LinkedIn post, you know, saying how awesome they were or something that they were like, that was a really good positive.

00:23:34,630 --> 00:23:37,690
You know, for others, they're like, Eh, I don't, that's not really me.

00:23:37,759 --> 00:23:41,500
You know, that public praise isn't what triggers my Yeah.

00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:49,130
So, one of the first things when I started my business is I became certified in the five languages of appreciation in the workplace.

00:23:49,410 --> 00:23:52,730
And so, research shows Is that like the five love languages spun off of there?

00:23:52,730 --> 00:23:54,950
Yes, it's spun off the five love languages.

00:23:55,750 --> 00:24:04,220
You know, just like personal relationships are important, um, work relationships are important, and so they're I wrote about that some years ago, actually.

00:24:04,220 --> 00:24:05,569
Yeah, I remember that.

00:24:05,910 --> 00:24:11,789
Um, so there's five universal ways that humans feel appreciated, and most people don't know that.

00:24:11,799 --> 00:24:16,519
They just know how they feel appreciated, and it's often how they communicate appreciation to others.

00:24:16,819 --> 00:24:23,109
So, um, Mine in the workplace is words of affirmation, but for other people, they think words are cheap.

00:24:24,079 --> 00:24:30,640
Like I actually met someone like, yeah, when I get a thank you card, like it means nothing to me.

00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,490
I feel bad throwing it away.

00:24:33,025 --> 00:24:38,984
As opposed to me, I'm, like, putting it in, like, my keepsake shoebox, you know, because it's so meaningful to me.

00:24:39,224 --> 00:24:48,934
Um, but, right, the example you gave, even when two people, um, have the same language of words of affirmation, there can be different, um, nuances.

00:24:48,934 --> 00:25:02,875
So someone might like thank you cards, but someone wants you to sing their praises publicly on LinkedIn or in front of a large crowd, um, and so knowing, like, what makes them light up.

00:25:03,059 --> 00:25:03,509
Right?

00:25:03,539 --> 00:25:22,144
Having those detailed information about the words of affirmation is their language of appreciation, and they like it when you praise them in front of others, when you tell others what a great job they're doing, when you compliment them, then your and targeted for that person.

00:25:22,464 --> 00:25:26,355
Um, but someone else who thinks words are cheap, they value acts of service.

00:25:26,375 --> 00:25:28,474
They're like, don't tell me, show me.

00:25:28,605 --> 00:25:33,365
So they want you to, um, help them when you're not, when you don't have to, right?

00:25:33,914 --> 00:25:36,765
Like if you're required to, then it's not really an act of service.

00:25:37,105 --> 00:25:44,005
But they really just want you to notice when they need a little help and, you know, help make their lives easier every now and then.

00:25:44,224 --> 00:25:47,694
And to them, that's much more important and meaningful than a thing.

00:25:47,855 --> 00:25:48,335
Handwritten.

00:25:48,335 --> 00:25:49,005
Thank you card.

00:25:49,345 --> 00:25:54,924
So, um, that's part of like the workforce of today is really getting to know people as individuals.

00:25:55,605 --> 00:26:02,035
Some workplaces may do group appreciation really well and say, Hey, you know, they provide swag and they have the employees a month.

00:26:02,095 --> 00:26:05,224
Yeah, company lunch or something like that.

00:26:05,525 --> 00:26:12,974
But then, um, or they might say, like, our organization's doing well, or good job department, or marketing department.

00:26:13,255 --> 00:26:15,144
But people want to be seen as individuals.

00:26:15,154 --> 00:26:16,545
So there has to be balance there.

00:26:16,545 --> 00:26:22,535
While those things are great, it's, if you really want to communicate your value for someone, you have to speak to the individual.

00:26:22,795 --> 00:26:24,345
And that's where the five languages come in.

00:26:24,345 --> 00:26:26,214
And it's one of my most popular workshops.

00:26:26,265 --> 00:26:27,755
What's the other three languages?

00:26:27,755 --> 00:26:29,535
So, So it's quality time.

00:26:29,575 --> 00:26:29,964
Okay.

00:26:30,855 --> 00:26:32,954
I already said acts of service, words of affirmation.

00:26:33,474 --> 00:26:38,134
tangible GIFs, and then appropriate physical touch.

00:26:39,615 --> 00:26:40,275
So it's the same.

00:26:40,275 --> 00:26:42,775
It's the same elements as the love languages.

00:26:42,825 --> 00:26:49,394
Yes, but when you take the assessment to identify your languages, physical touch is not even on there.

00:26:49,474 --> 00:26:57,625
Because it's no one's most important language in the workplace, and there's definitely no no's on what's okay and what's not.

00:26:57,884 --> 00:27:07,015
Um, and even like, You know, um, I was doing a training and this woman raised her hand and said she likes no physical touch in the workplace.

00:27:07,055 --> 00:27:12,775
I mean, including, you know, what I say, handshakes, they're usually done in celebration, pats on the back, high five.

00:27:12,775 --> 00:27:14,275
She's like, I don't want to do any of it.

00:27:14,525 --> 00:27:16,224
Well, she has a thing about germs.

00:27:16,234 --> 00:27:16,265
Right.

00:27:16,275 --> 00:27:18,690
So, it's all, even with that one, it's like.

00:27:18,839 --> 00:27:25,990
Look at, like, how they react, and if it doesn't seem well received, even if it seems appropriate, don't do it again.

00:27:27,099 --> 00:27:28,509
But yeah, that one's very low.

00:27:28,539 --> 00:27:29,779
It's less than 1%.

00:27:30,250 --> 00:27:34,299
But what surprises people are, you know, there's a lot of gifts being given in the workplace.

00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:35,470
That's kind of a norm.

00:27:36,099 --> 00:27:41,420
Um, but it's actually less than 5 percent say it's their, um, most valued.

00:27:41,559 --> 00:27:44,680
So the acts of service, quality time.

00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:47,789
So that's like, I know that's one of the things that Alma values.

00:27:47,789 --> 00:27:53,849
Like tomorrow, her mom doesn't have access to a car, uh, and has a doctor's appointment because her car is in the shop.

00:27:53,849 --> 00:28:00,259
So Alma's going to go pick up her mom and take her to the doctor's appointment and take her back home and come back to work after two hours or something.

00:28:00,859 --> 00:28:06,045
And like, to me, that's, That's a great, small benefit that I could do for my team.

00:28:06,394 --> 00:28:07,125
Yes, it is.

00:28:08,085 --> 00:28:10,999
Um, very, if, yeah, that is her, and we usually have two.

00:28:10,999 --> 00:28:13,855
So maybe that's an act of service almost, from my perspective.

00:28:13,914 --> 00:28:23,244
I don't know if, whether that's quality time, or whether that's Well, um, I would say yes, it is an act of service, and then you're allowing her to have quality time with her mother, too.

00:28:23,255 --> 00:28:23,954
Yeah, fair.

00:28:23,974 --> 00:28:24,505
You know?

00:28:24,914 --> 00:28:26,315
So, um Access to quality time.

00:28:26,315 --> 00:28:27,115
And that's the thing, too.

00:28:27,115 --> 00:28:30,944
So you can, when I help organizations You know, design their culture.

00:28:30,944 --> 00:28:38,005
I try to help them weave in different languages, like, for example, if you had an employee get together.

00:28:38,015 --> 00:28:42,674
So let's say you provide lunch for the office so that, um, is a tangible gift.

00:28:42,674 --> 00:28:43,944
You're providing free food.

00:28:44,164 --> 00:28:47,525
You're providing quality time by letting everyone come together.

00:28:47,755 --> 00:28:50,250
Let's say you, you know, You know, say recognize a couple of people.

00:28:50,410 --> 00:28:51,029
Yes.

00:28:51,029 --> 00:28:51,480
Yes.

00:28:51,500 --> 00:28:53,529
Do some words of affirmation.

00:28:53,799 --> 00:28:55,470
Um, you pick up the food.

00:28:55,519 --> 00:28:59,480
That's an act of service as opposed to having your staff get it right.

00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:01,390
You know, or you help clean up.

00:29:01,670 --> 00:29:04,019
So those are things that people, you know, notice.

00:29:04,275 --> 00:29:09,025
That's like, um, who's, who value those languages, like, they're always the ones cleaning up.

00:29:09,035 --> 00:29:13,335
But then this time you do it, they're like, oh, wow, this is really, this is really nice.

00:29:13,355 --> 00:29:15,644
Well, you're really talking about servant leadership, kind of.

00:29:15,694 --> 00:29:16,484
Exactly.

00:29:16,505 --> 00:29:16,884
Exactly.

00:29:16,924 --> 00:29:18,914
And then you throw in some high fives in there.

00:29:19,335 --> 00:29:19,555
Right.

00:29:19,555 --> 00:29:19,984
A little crab ass.

00:29:19,984 --> 00:29:20,595
So, yeah.

00:29:20,595 --> 00:29:20,805
Okay.

00:29:22,065 --> 00:29:23,115
Just at the company party.

00:29:24,625 --> 00:29:25,785
I'm kidding.

00:29:25,785 --> 00:29:27,265
I just had an HR person on here recently.

00:29:27,464 --> 00:29:28,474
She's cool with me for that kind of thing.

00:29:28,474 --> 00:29:28,634
Yeah.

00:29:28,634 --> 00:29:39,894
That's why I know I always have that like disclaimer about appropriate physical touch because I do speak to a lot of HR groups and I don't want anyone to have a heart attack about like, what are you trying to teach people?

00:29:40,575 --> 00:29:54,515
Well, I think for, for most of us men, at least like kind of since me too, We're all like, once bitten, twice shy, like I'm always, I'll offer the side hug, but I'm not going straight on anymore, even if somebody has to grab that from me, right?

00:29:54,795 --> 00:29:59,315
Well, and then some people have even taken to always ask before I go in for a hug, like, is it okay?

00:29:59,315 --> 00:29:59,755
I'm a hugger.

00:29:59,775 --> 00:30:00,474
Can I hug you?

00:30:00,724 --> 00:30:02,714
And then just, you know, wait for that.

00:30:02,724 --> 00:30:07,855
Well, even for, I'm like, it's probably pretty common still for girls to hug girls, it seems like.

00:30:08,055 --> 00:30:12,865
Um, and I still have a lot of people that hug me, you know, at the Rotary Club or different places or whatever.

00:30:13,055 --> 00:30:13,404
Yeah.

00:30:13,404 --> 00:30:13,920
Yeah.

00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:18,279
And, it's, you know, I don't initiate, I initiate side hugs.

00:30:18,279 --> 00:30:19,549
I don't initiate others.

00:30:19,549 --> 00:30:20,119
Yeah, yeah.

00:30:20,119 --> 00:30:21,160
They don't say where to go.

00:30:21,210 --> 00:30:21,519
Yeah.

00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:29,029
So, what, are there certain types, or, uh, you know, are you professional services focused or retail?

00:30:29,069 --> 00:30:36,299
Are there certain industries or types of company that you find yourself being engaged by more than others?

00:30:36,299 --> 00:30:36,710
Um.

00:30:36,789 --> 00:30:37,170
Um.

00:30:38,204 --> 00:30:50,015
You know, I get that question and I really have just a diverse group of clients from non profit to pharmaceuticals to small businesses, manufacturing.

00:30:50,025 --> 00:30:54,575
Actually, my longest client is a wood coatings manufacturer.

00:30:54,904 --> 00:31:07,119
And so I mentioned, I, you know, I'm also a leadership trainer, um, and so oftentimes how I'm engaged is often for a training first, and then it kind of uncovers like, Okay, there's some like deeper things that need to be addressed.

00:31:07,119 --> 00:31:11,259
And then I'm brought in to do the culture design and employee engagement program.

00:31:11,569 --> 00:31:15,299
And, um, yeah, Gemini Codings is my longest client.

00:31:15,529 --> 00:31:18,789
And one of I've done five languages of appreciation training for them.

00:31:18,799 --> 00:31:21,670
I've helped do their employee engagement program.

00:31:21,670 --> 00:31:30,920
And And then one of the things I'm most proud of is I've done for the past three years, uh, leadership training program for them that I've designed and facilitated.

00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:32,430
It's a six month program.

00:31:32,579 --> 00:31:35,220
Each year they pick 10 people to go through it.

00:31:35,569 --> 00:31:42,509
And new managers, um, well, the first year the cohort was, um, their upper managers.

00:31:42,759 --> 00:31:50,950
Some were directors, but people they, um, identified as, um, who would step into an executive role at some point and maybe someone left.

00:31:51,359 --> 00:31:58,410
Then the second year it was their middle managers, very important to the organization, um, you know, high potential.

00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:06,210
Then the third year, young professionals that they were scared are going to get poached by the competition.

00:32:06,210 --> 00:32:10,430
And so they really wanted to bring them in, let them know they had a future at the organization.

00:32:10,710 --> 00:32:23,944
So we, I, um, Pick the curriculum for the cohort, but it's more than leadership training because I have we it was designed where I had them for two days a month for six months.

00:32:24,244 --> 00:32:27,654
And so during that time, we're able to do a lot of team building.

00:32:27,694 --> 00:32:43,190
I had a segment called inside the mind of a leader where we would bring in one of their executives or board members to, they had 30 minutes to talk about their career, um, leadership lessons learned, um, maybe the heart, the hard way.

00:32:44,339 --> 00:32:54,140
And then I would, and then I would cut them off because I wanted 30 minutes of Q and a, and they had a, you know, a policy like they could ask.

00:32:54,140 --> 00:32:55,450
Yeah, exactly.

00:32:55,460 --> 00:32:57,309
And so that built a lot of trust.

00:32:57,339 --> 00:33:04,569
Well, one, um, just like, Having the CEO like talk about his childhood and how it shaped him.

00:33:04,809 --> 00:33:09,539
Um, but then yes, asking questions about, Hey, why did, you know, why'd you fire Brian?

00:33:10,509 --> 00:33:10,809
Yeah.

00:33:10,809 --> 00:33:14,099
Or why did you buy that company that failed?

00:33:14,599 --> 00:33:17,289
Like we lost a lot of money and there's so much.

00:33:17,615 --> 00:33:22,575
Understanding and trust building that goes into that because you think like, Oh, I would have handled it a certain way.

00:33:22,575 --> 00:33:23,325
Why didn't you?

00:33:23,325 --> 00:33:27,154
But then they unpack everything that went into that decision.

00:33:27,174 --> 00:33:30,815
And then when they realized, you know, it wasn't going to work out.

00:33:31,390 --> 00:33:36,599
All the thought process that went into, you know, mitigating, mitigating it.

00:33:36,779 --> 00:33:43,890
And so there's, they understood the inner workings of the business that they're usually not a part of.

00:33:44,220 --> 00:33:48,349
They had a lot more respect for their leadership and knowing what that happens.

00:33:48,349 --> 00:33:52,109
And then they felt like they're part of the inner circle because they're able to learn so much.

00:33:52,130 --> 00:34:15,230
And think about the retention piece when you feel like you're part of the inner circle and involved, um, So, uh, that was very important, and then we'd also, a huge piece was, um, that everyone enjoyed is different case studies that, of things that either did happen to the company, was currently happening, or could realistically happen in the near future.

00:34:15,489 --> 00:34:25,289
So, some of those case studies included, included, I'm from Oklahoma, like a tornado hitting a facility, so it could be a cyber attack.

00:34:26,010 --> 00:34:33,219
Another one that was currently happening was they wanted to, um, redesign their financial incentive program.

00:34:33,219 --> 00:34:34,010
So bonuses.

00:34:34,010 --> 00:34:35,000
What does that look like?

00:34:35,019 --> 00:34:46,780
And man, everyone had opinion on that one, but then when it came to realizing like what would make the managers happy and the executives happy and the hourly, um, workers happy.

00:34:46,780 --> 00:34:49,789
It was really hard to design something that would make everyone happy.

00:34:49,820 --> 00:34:54,369
And, you know, promote working together as a thing.

00:34:54,369 --> 00:34:54,679
Yes.

00:34:54,809 --> 00:34:55,010
Yes.

00:34:55,210 --> 00:34:58,349
As opposed to like, I'm just gonna see why a, you know, I don't care about myself.

00:34:58,349 --> 00:35:02,320
I'm not helping you, but promoting exactly the goals you want.

00:35:02,519 --> 00:35:11,260
So, um, in my industry, uh, in banking, there's certain banks over the years that would have like very big incentives for new loan production.

00:35:11,820 --> 00:35:17,695
So the, you know, bankers might pay Maybe it would make 70, 000 or 100, 000 a year, depending on your tenure and whatever.

00:35:18,445 --> 00:35:27,110
But some of the banks would, you know, do like, allow you to make 50, 000, 100, 000, 150, 000 extra in like, Commission for landing commercial accounts.

00:35:28,019 --> 00:35:41,369
And then inevitably within three years, that bank would be in trouble because those people would get through a bunch of bad credit risk customers, you know, when you're, when you're paying that much incentive, cause it's kind of a dual incentive as a, as a commercial lender.

00:35:41,380 --> 00:35:45,070
You have to go get customers, but don't get the wrong ones.

00:35:45,679 --> 00:35:49,630
And, and based on those incentives, you, you never know what's going to happen sometimes.

00:35:49,630 --> 00:35:56,054
You know, if you're incenting based on gross margin of, you know, of a sales of a package thing.

00:35:56,054 --> 00:36:01,405
Well, maybe then you get your sales people that are ripping off their customers and ruining your reputation.

00:36:01,675 --> 00:36:03,394
Yeah, that's a great example of, right.

00:36:03,394 --> 00:36:07,085
It has to promote the positive behaviors that you want.

00:36:07,144 --> 00:36:11,474
Um, and then something that was likely to happen was an acquisition.

00:36:11,695 --> 00:36:14,125
And so when you have these problems, right.

00:36:14,375 --> 00:36:27,030
Um, you put them in groups and they're from different departments and they have to, you know, Use the information they have to make the, you know, the best decision based on what they have, and they really started to respect each other's strengths.

00:36:27,030 --> 00:36:31,920
Like you may be the numbers guy, but I know operations and this person knows people.

00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,639
And so together with all of our strengths, we can come up with a really great plan.

00:36:35,869 --> 00:36:38,869
And then they would present that their solution.

00:36:39,179 --> 00:36:41,289
And then we would have the executive plan.

00:36:41,394 --> 00:36:49,094
Um, if it's something that already happens, like, actually, here's how it went down, but I like what you said, and I wish we had handled it better that way.

00:36:49,295 --> 00:36:49,534
Yeah.

00:36:49,534 --> 00:37:00,824
And so it was a group learning experience and people really learned, um, what each other's strengths were, which means when it came time to real world problems, they're more likely to reach out.

00:37:01,625 --> 00:37:04,824
Exactly because they worked on this scenario together.

00:37:05,034 --> 00:37:09,894
So there's, I mean, there's a lot that goes into that leadership program and in it.

00:37:09,905 --> 00:37:14,405
So over the three years out of those 30 people had a 92 percent retention right.

00:37:14,605 --> 00:37:15,405
Well, it seems pretty good.

00:37:16,094 --> 00:37:16,394
Yep.

00:37:16,715 --> 00:37:17,235
Are you?

00:37:17,619 --> 00:37:27,840
It sounds like there's a lot of custom creation stuff, but are you choosing from a, aside from the five level languages and maybe there's some materials and courses, or are you part of an affiliation?

00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:33,179
Are you creating new tools and ideas all constantly for your clients, both?

00:37:33,210 --> 00:37:38,480
So, with that one, I had a curriculum that we subscribed to with different leadership topics.

00:37:38,489 --> 00:37:41,739
I see, so there's like different, almost like a database that you can subscribe to.

00:37:41,739 --> 00:37:44,079
You can kind of get curriculum builders and stuff.

00:37:44,170 --> 00:37:44,699
Mm hmm.

00:37:44,755 --> 00:37:46,965
And then I've done a lot of custom stuff on my own.

00:37:46,965 --> 00:37:50,724
So it's probably half and half, yeah, at the end of the day.

00:37:51,215 --> 00:37:51,655
Fair enough.

00:37:51,974 --> 00:37:53,375
Um, should we shift to the book?

00:37:53,675 --> 00:37:54,235
Yeah, sure.

00:37:54,355 --> 00:38:01,135
Um, was this, uh, like where, where obviously the let go of the rope has been with you for a long time.

00:38:01,764 --> 00:38:04,414
Um, has it been a book in your head for a long time?

00:38:04,465 --> 00:38:05,175
It has.

00:38:05,500 --> 00:38:06,030
It has.

00:38:06,030 --> 00:38:10,639
And that's why my husband was like, why are you writing a book on employee engagement, retention, right?

00:38:10,809 --> 00:38:11,449
Appreciation.

00:38:12,630 --> 00:38:18,070
And I was like, and I told him, I was like, this book has been in me to write for a really long time.

00:38:18,449 --> 00:38:29,219
And, um, I mentioned earlier that I'm a lifetime member of girl scouts and actually when I was board chair for two years and, um, that was a huge undertaking.

00:38:29,230 --> 00:38:32,264
You know, Like Board of Girl Scouts in Oklahoma or something?

00:38:32,264 --> 00:38:34,985
Yeah, Girl Scouts Western Oklahoma, out the state.

00:38:35,364 --> 00:38:46,295
And so the book was even delayed those two years because I took up, I ended up taking a lot more time than I thought and so, um, when my tenure was done I was really excited to dive in.

00:38:46,545 --> 00:38:54,425
But, yes, so I had that experience at the age of nine and my family was very outdoorsy so backpacking.

00:38:54,889 --> 00:38:56,800
Um, increase my confidence as well.

00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:56,969
Right.

00:38:56,969 --> 00:39:02,775
In terms of Well, by the time you're 11, you're like out climbing some of these 14 year old, 16 year old boys and stuff.

00:39:02,775 --> 00:39:03,385
Some, yeah.

00:39:03,385 --> 00:39:07,480
But, um, like with the backpacking, just, you know, I was always, like I said, really little.

00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:09,750
And so we have these thoughts, right?

00:39:09,750 --> 00:39:11,730
We have our head like, I'm just a girl.

00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:12,625
Or I'm just a girl.

00:39:12,775 --> 00:39:16,085
this little, like, short person, like, what can I do?

00:39:16,315 --> 00:39:22,844
But then, you know, my dad would plan these backpacking trips and I have to carry all my gear and I had no choice but to walk.

00:39:23,485 --> 00:39:25,525
I couldn't, didn't want to be left in the woods.

00:39:25,525 --> 00:39:29,465
And sometimes, you know, we had no water until we got to our destination.

00:39:29,675 --> 00:39:32,425
So it's like, that was a motivation to keep going.

00:39:32,755 --> 00:39:48,583
Um, and so, I would get to the destination and realize, like, wow, you know, I've hiked eight miles with a backpack on today, like, and up a mountain we did day hikes, too, and it just made you realize you're a lot more capable than you think you are, and that my hike was worth it.

00:39:48,583 --> 00:39:48,590
Bye.

00:39:49,090 --> 00:39:58,269
Sex didn't define me, my physical stature didn't define me, um, and so all these things like, it made me question, right?

00:39:58,269 --> 00:40:07,179
Like, when I had thoughts about self limiting beliefs, it made me question them and wonder, okay, but if I try, maybe, you know, it'll change.

00:40:07,369 --> 00:40:07,400
that.

00:40:07,409 --> 00:40:08,150
Exactly.

00:40:08,159 --> 00:40:08,179
Yeah.

00:40:08,190 --> 00:40:14,409
So, um, all, and a lot of the things that we did, I think it made me want to try new things.

00:40:14,505 --> 00:40:18,335
even hard things because, you know, like I said, rock climbing is not easy.

00:40:18,344 --> 00:40:19,574
Backpacking is not easy.

00:40:19,574 --> 00:40:25,085
And you kind of, you have that track record and you're realized, well, I've done hard things before.

00:40:25,105 --> 00:40:28,974
I think maybe I'll try this new hard thing and see where it takes me.

00:40:29,005 --> 00:40:30,465
Maybe I'll surprise myself.

00:40:30,905 --> 00:40:32,264
My wife is four foot 11.

00:40:32,454 --> 00:40:34,885
Uh, so she's a shorty as well.

00:40:35,135 --> 00:40:42,614
Um, and like running, like I can run way faster backwards than she can run forwards physically.

00:40:42,644 --> 00:40:44,045
Like she just doesn't have that.

00:40:45,065 --> 00:40:46,155
But she's a tractor.

00:40:46,335 --> 00:40:53,835
Like, we've gone on 5, 7, 10 mile backpacking hikes and things like that with her carrying 30 or 40 pounds and me carrying maybe 10 more.

00:40:54,235 --> 00:40:55,815
But I'm nearly twice as big.

00:40:56,525 --> 00:40:58,155
And, uh, she can just hike.

00:40:58,304 --> 00:40:58,664
Yeah.

00:40:58,675 --> 00:40:59,744
She's like a Sherpa.

00:41:00,025 --> 00:41:01,204
Something like that, yeah.

00:41:01,764 --> 00:41:03,775
That's probably more of a compliment than tractor.

00:41:05,065 --> 00:41:09,425
But as long as she's slow and steady, she can just, and she keeps the same pace as me.

00:41:09,994 --> 00:41:11,590
When we're hiking, carrying a load.

00:41:12,099 --> 00:41:13,739
So, anyway, for what it's worth, hi Jill.

00:41:14,070 --> 00:41:14,889
Hope you listened to this one.

00:41:14,889 --> 00:41:17,670
She didn't listen to very many of them.

00:41:17,670 --> 00:41:20,797
Um, yeah, so, like, right, you can surprise yourself.

00:41:20,797 --> 00:41:24,690
And, um, yeah, so it's good to not limit yourself unless, until you've even tried it, right?

00:41:24,690 --> 00:41:26,250
And that, you should open that door.

00:41:26,429 --> 00:41:31,000
Something from my book that I tell people is that fear is not a stop sign.

00:41:31,210 --> 00:41:32,679
So a lot of times, right?

00:41:32,679 --> 00:41:35,550
Like, like going back to the rock climbing, it's like, Oh, that seems scary.

00:41:35,550 --> 00:41:36,619
I don't even want to try it.

00:41:36,619 --> 00:41:38,449
I mean, or I'm going to like not continue.

00:41:38,780 --> 00:41:40,840
And so I say fear is a yield sign.

00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:55,170
So there's something that your mind, your body is telling you like, Hey, well on the surface rock climbing does seem dangerous, but then when you calculate like all the safety protocols and equipment, then you're, then you can like rationalize, like it is safe.

00:41:55,219 --> 00:41:55,539
Right.

00:41:55,539 --> 00:42:03,105
It's actually, and then one of the things my dad raised us on is, you know, Um, riding in a car is one of the most dangerous things you'll ever do in a day.

00:42:03,315 --> 00:42:14,125
So all the crazy things and outdoor, uh, outdoor adventures, things we did, like rock climbing and whitewater rafting and backpacking, like didn't seem so dangerous to go hiking.

00:42:14,125 --> 00:42:15,684
Yeah, exactly.

00:42:15,704 --> 00:42:17,215
Based on statistics.

00:42:17,244 --> 00:42:20,635
And so that also like was something in my head.

00:42:21,224 --> 00:42:32,684
Um, and so, right, so that was, so it's a yield sign, so stop and think, but continue forward unless it actually is a physical danger to your life.

00:42:32,885 --> 00:42:33,875
the three simple steps?

00:42:34,155 --> 00:42:35,224
No, it's not.

00:42:35,235 --> 00:42:45,335
So the three simple steps, um, so I kind of, confidence had been on my mind, I don't know why, but I just, um, Like internalize it.

00:42:45,355 --> 00:42:52,184
I mean, I wasn't like talking to my parents and friends about confidence But it's just something that I realized like that desire one of your superpowers.

00:42:52,184 --> 00:42:52,255
Yeah.

00:42:52,534 --> 00:42:54,704
Yeah Exactly.

00:42:54,715 --> 00:43:02,039
It's like I'm willing to try new things put myself out there get out of my comfort zone Um, also just, you know, believing in myself.

00:43:02,039 --> 00:43:10,489
I feel like in junior high, um, you see some people making kind of poor decisions because they don't have great self esteem and they don't have a lot of confidence.

00:43:10,500 --> 00:43:11,699
So I noticed that.

00:43:12,059 --> 00:43:22,929
And then, um, you know, and then in high school in sports and then people with their desire, like am I going to, you know, Try to go to this big university or this university out of state, right?

00:43:22,929 --> 00:43:32,159
I feel like sometimes applying for colleges like says a lot about your confidence because you may have all the credentials, but then you're like, Oh, but I don't belong there.

00:43:32,500 --> 00:43:37,750
Or I'm too scared to move out of state or I don't want to go somewhere where my friends aren't going.

00:43:38,099 --> 00:43:38,650
Right.

00:43:38,699 --> 00:43:41,289
You know, where I grew up in rural North Dakota.

00:43:42,679 --> 00:43:57,469
Um, I was sure, even though I was like one of the smartest kids in my classes in, when it was a high school of 50, 60 kids, I was sure when I went to college at North Dakota State that I was going to be way dumber than all those city kids and stuff that were going to be there.

00:43:58,199 --> 00:43:59,800
I just, just the culture I grew up in.

00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:00,159
Yeah.

00:44:00,230 --> 00:44:00,559
And.

00:44:00,809 --> 00:44:02,349
You thought small town versus big city.

00:44:02,389 --> 00:44:03,030
Kinda, yeah.

00:44:03,030 --> 00:44:06,289
And it took me a couple years almost before I was like, oh, I was wrong.

00:44:06,389 --> 00:44:07,320
Exactly.

00:44:07,530 --> 00:44:08,170
Exactly.

00:44:08,500 --> 00:44:11,849
Um, and so I just, I was kind of an observer.

00:44:11,929 --> 00:44:12,199
Yeah.

00:44:12,230 --> 00:44:12,579
Yeah.

00:44:12,579 --> 00:44:12,704
Yeah.

00:44:12,704 --> 00:44:12,829
Yeah.

00:44:12,829 --> 00:44:14,039
And then, um.

00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:17,610
I graduated college, and I wanted to volunteer.

00:44:17,610 --> 00:44:19,960
I've always volunteered in, you know, in college.

00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:38,965
It was in campus activities, things, and I was part of the, I did, I did leadership for Collins, but before that I did leadership for Oklahoma City, and before that I did, I did loyal programs called Linking Oklahoma City's Young Adult Leaders, and I was in the, Inaugural class, and so it was a retention tool, right, against brain drain.

00:44:38,974 --> 00:44:45,394
So I was in this inaugural class and we had a guest speaker, and I wish I remembered his name, but he gave me some life changing advice.

00:44:45,614 --> 00:44:58,414
He said, instead of volunteering randomly at one organization to another, he said, stop and reflect on what's important to you, what you're interested in, and how you may want to make an impact in the world.

00:44:59,010 --> 00:45:02,199
And then pick a non profit organization that matches that.

00:45:02,650 --> 00:45:08,050
So I went through that exercise and I decided, I really like children, working with children.

00:45:08,099 --> 00:45:09,829
I didn't have children then, it was right after college.

00:45:10,130 --> 00:45:16,760
I really like the outdoors, and helping other people build confidence is important to me.

00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:20,139
And having, you know, adventurous experience is important to me.

00:45:20,519 --> 00:45:23,485
And I did my research and, Guess what I came across?

00:45:24,565 --> 00:45:25,485
Girl Scouts.

00:45:25,775 --> 00:45:27,074
Fit my criteria.

00:45:27,264 --> 00:45:30,945
And he said, oh, and he said, and you see yourself volunteering there long term.

00:45:31,574 --> 00:45:36,405
So, um, I was not a Girl Scout growing up, so I did not even have that tie.

00:45:36,454 --> 00:45:37,235
Well, you basically were, though.

00:45:37,235 --> 00:45:37,695
I know.

00:45:37,695 --> 00:45:39,304
You were backpacking and cross country skiing.

00:45:39,304 --> 00:45:45,125
I did a lot of those things, but I didn't sell cookies and I didn't earn patches and badges, which I totally would have loved.

00:45:45,125 --> 00:45:46,704
for the cookies, by the way.

00:45:46,704 --> 00:45:47,244
You're welcome.

00:45:47,585 --> 00:45:49,505
And so, um, yeah.

00:45:49,505 --> 00:45:51,434
And so I picked Girl Scouts.

00:45:51,849 --> 00:45:58,090
And it worked out because I was volunteering with them for 15 years, right?

00:45:58,110 --> 00:46:03,730
Troop leader, board member, executive committee board member, board chair.

00:46:04,030 --> 00:46:11,550
And so, um, It was life changing advice, and it just goes to show, you know, like Have you gotten re involved with the Girl Scouts here in Colorado yet?

00:46:11,989 --> 00:46:20,760
Um, I'm in talks with them to do a workshop, either for their adult volunteers or their girls on creating unlimited confidence.

00:46:21,090 --> 00:46:25,880
Yeah, so I'm not volunteering with them yet, but kind of like just taking a pause.

00:46:25,889 --> 00:46:31,230
Well, you're kind of re establishing your business in a new town and all that kind of stuff, so you get a pass on that.

00:46:31,539 --> 00:46:33,996
Um What were the three simple steps, by the way?

00:46:33,996 --> 00:46:36,574
So the first one is create clarity.

00:46:36,775 --> 00:46:41,045
So that one is really understanding who you are, what's important to you.

00:46:41,295 --> 00:46:43,885
The self reflection, like what are your core values?

00:46:43,885 --> 00:46:45,885
Do you have a personal mission statement?

00:46:46,184 --> 00:46:50,045
So that's your guiding light because in the world there's, right.

00:46:50,065 --> 00:46:52,784
There's always people have an opinion, like, Oh, you should be doing this.

00:46:52,784 --> 00:46:53,885
You should be trying this.

00:46:53,885 --> 00:47:00,804
You should like, if you just listen to opinions, like you would be all over the place and you wouldn't know what to do because they're, you know, Conflicting all the time.

00:47:00,804 --> 00:47:22,275
So once you're centered and grounded and understanding who you are and what's important to you, then you can create confidence that you can make decisions and do things because You want to, that's, you know, what's important to you and you're not always, um, shifting with the winds of change and what opinion and things like that.

00:47:22,275 --> 00:47:24,045
Keep your pointer on what you're trying to achieve.

00:47:24,054 --> 00:47:24,474
Right.

00:47:24,905 --> 00:47:25,244
Right.

00:47:25,255 --> 00:47:30,244
So, I feel like a lot, so I do that, I learned a lot about myself through journaling.

00:47:30,244 --> 00:47:34,364
I mean, that's one of the best ways To kind of understand who you are and what's important to you.

00:47:34,385 --> 00:47:38,784
Cause as you're writing kind of reveals itself, like if you're writing about it, it probably is important to you.

00:47:39,985 --> 00:47:40,155
Yeah.

00:47:40,155 --> 00:47:44,914
If you're angry about something, well, what was it about that that made you so angry is probably cause it was important to you.

00:47:45,215 --> 00:47:48,914
So I feel like there's a lot of people who miss out on what's important to you.

00:47:49,375 --> 00:47:51,655
Um, and so that is foundational.

00:47:51,684 --> 00:47:53,054
That's why it was step one.

00:47:53,085 --> 00:47:55,605
So the second one is create self trust.

00:47:55,934 --> 00:47:59,005
So that's actually how I define confidence is.

00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:05,940
Self trust because other people there's different ways to do it, but to me When you trust yourself, right?

00:48:06,179 --> 00:48:23,309
Um, you believe in who you are and your abilities, and even if, that doesn't mean you know you'll be successful, but you trust that, um, I'm going to learn from my mistakes and I'm going to be able to move forward, or I can figure out the answers as I go, or I can talk to people who have done it and figure out the answers as I go.

00:48:23,619 --> 00:48:31,820
But, um, there's different ways to create self trust, but, um, But keeping your word to yourself, keeping your promises to yourself is a huge one.

00:48:32,210 --> 00:48:36,666
Because it's hard to have confidence if you say you're going to do something and then you don't do it.

00:48:36,666 --> 00:48:37,329
Constantly don't do it.

00:48:37,329 --> 00:48:38,059
Exactly.

00:48:38,070 --> 00:48:44,550
One of my past podcast guests was Richard Fagerlin, who wrote the book Trustology.

00:48:44,550 --> 00:48:53,659
And one of the things that I've carried around with me since that conversation was his assertion, if you will, that trust could not be earned, it can only be granted.

00:48:53,659 --> 00:48:57,849
Uh, so if confidence is self trust.

00:48:58,449 --> 00:49:06,199
Uh, you can only give yourself trust, not earn it really, which I suppose that's contrary almost to your premise.

00:49:06,210 --> 00:49:06,230
Yeah.

00:49:06,699 --> 00:49:11,019
Well, um, to But if you trust yourself, I mean, you're the one that can do that, then you better just perform.

00:49:11,019 --> 00:49:11,380
Right.

00:49:11,989 --> 00:49:12,900
Live up to that trust.

00:49:12,909 --> 00:49:13,389
Yeah.

00:49:13,679 --> 00:49:14,099
Yeah.

00:49:14,369 --> 00:49:22,849
And so, I feel like, yeah, it's both, because ultimately, like, you have to, you can't just say I trust myself.

00:49:23,010 --> 00:49:23,380
Right.

00:49:23,380 --> 00:49:28,550
I mean, so to me it has to really be this, like, thing of, like, I'm not sure it works with the self trust model.

00:49:28,909 --> 00:49:34,730
Um, but, yeah, so creating self trust is important because, um, Right.

00:49:34,739 --> 00:50:01,369
So keeping your word, but then also like I talked about earlier have coming up with the things the difficult things You've done in the past built self trust because you may forget like someone were like, oh, yeah I overcame that speech impediment as a child and that was a huge accomplishment and so it gave her more self trust knowing like Wow, if I can do that, which she had forgotten about, she hadn't thought about it very much, it's like, Oh, I can take that, um, self trust and put it into something else, right?

00:50:01,369 --> 00:50:04,400
In this new job that she had that she had switched careers.

00:50:04,690 --> 00:50:09,320
And so something as simple as that, um, can really build your self trust.

00:50:09,349 --> 00:50:13,309
And then the third step is create to create confidence.

00:50:13,340 --> 00:50:14,840
And that's the take action piece.

00:50:14,849 --> 00:50:21,239
So a lot of people think they need to have confidence in order to take action, but you actually take action to create confidence.

00:50:21,769 --> 00:50:27,559
And so I use the word create because in our society, there's a lot around it.

00:50:27,775 --> 00:50:30,324
Consuming things to become confident, right?

00:50:30,335 --> 00:50:37,784
Like drink this You know health shake and you'll you'll have confidence or buy these clothes and makeup.

00:50:37,795 --> 00:50:42,764
Or watch Andrew Tate videos Yeah, you know buy Pelotons, spend all this money.

00:50:42,925 --> 00:50:50,554
You'll have confidence like so many Uh, things are, uh, marketed to us for confidence and sex appeal and, but it's all about consuming.

00:50:50,565 --> 00:51:05,105
Even my book, if you just consumed it and read it and did nothing with it, you're not going to have confidence because you have to take action, you have to create something, an experience, something new, you know, to move forward and, um, create that confidence.

00:51:05,105 --> 00:51:06,775
It's created by action ultimately.

00:51:07,445 --> 00:51:12,635
That's one of the things I was going to ask you about in that, um, build self trust and that confidence.

00:51:12,795 --> 00:51:13,945
One thing I've seen.

00:51:14,909 --> 00:51:21,840
Some in millennials, but maybe even more in Gen Z is they've got confidence without foundations.

00:51:22,469 --> 00:51:30,440
They're like, pay me 40, 000 a year, I got a whatever, an accounting degree, or not even that, right?

00:51:30,750 --> 00:51:35,849
And they think they have earned all this, it's entitlement mentality, a little bit.

00:51:36,019 --> 00:51:36,960
A little bit, yeah.

00:51:37,019 --> 00:51:54,510
I think, I think, so I do think as you get older through life experiences, you do, um, get wiser and then you can, it's easier to grow in confidence because when you're young, you can be told things, but if you haven't lived in experience it, then you're just right.

00:51:54,510 --> 00:51:56,980
It's just knowledge and not firsthand experience.

00:51:57,219 --> 00:51:57,239
Yeah.

00:51:57,260 --> 00:52:09,394
So I think with them, Yes, they may, with that generation, feel that way, but I think as they move into the workplace and no one's paying them that amount of money for no experience, then they're, it's kind of a reality check, like, Oh, okay.

00:52:09,394 --> 00:52:11,375
Well, I like that your book is a call to action regardless.

00:52:11,425 --> 00:52:11,914
Yes, yeah.

00:52:11,914 --> 00:52:13,605
You know, you gotta take the creation effort.

00:52:13,655 --> 00:52:14,434
Exactly.

00:52:14,735 --> 00:52:20,925
Um, and so my book is filled with all of these, um, I call it time to climb activities.

00:52:21,235 --> 00:52:28,519
And so, ways small ways to put into action to get you out of your comfort zone and creating confidence for yourself.

00:52:28,539 --> 00:52:33,730
Because that's the promise I have is that if you learn to create confidence for yourself, no one can take it away.

00:52:34,099 --> 00:52:34,519
Right.

00:52:35,380 --> 00:52:38,929
And so you can maintain a high level of confidence over time.

00:52:39,304 --> 00:52:43,445
Even if, let's say you start a new job and your confidence dips, which is totally natural.

00:52:43,445 --> 00:52:45,764
None of us are like a hundred percent confident all the time.

00:52:46,074 --> 00:52:49,614
Even if it takes a dip, cause you're in a new environment, new people, right?

00:52:49,655 --> 00:52:57,244
I mean, a normal person would have a dip in confidence, but then you're not going to stay down low because you're going to find ways to get yourself.

00:52:57,394 --> 00:53:00,114
Yeah, find ways to learn, find ways to grow in this new career path.

00:53:00,465 --> 00:53:00,625
Exactly.

00:53:00,625 --> 00:53:05,954
And so when you have, you know, negative self talk that says like, oh, I'm never going to figure this out.

00:53:05,994 --> 00:53:06,599
This is just a job.

00:53:06,599 --> 00:53:07,440
Too hard.

00:53:07,739 --> 00:53:23,309
Then you go back to some of the exercise and like, let me make a list of the five difficult things I've already done, or let me make a list or, or set a coffee date of people I know who have been successful in this area that I can get some advice and wisdom so I don't have to recreate something from scratch.

00:53:23,550 --> 00:53:26,250
Um, and so I think that what I'm trying to get people unstuck.

00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:34,219
So if they're just like stuck and they're like, oh, well I can't do this, or I don't know if I, should I get them moving right.

00:53:34,550 --> 00:53:34,969
Is the book.

00:53:35,630 --> 00:53:39,530
Like, even a driver for your business kind of adjacent?

00:53:39,530 --> 00:53:40,659
Yeah, yeah.

00:53:40,659 --> 00:53:43,389
You're hoping that people will read your book and be like, Oh, that gal is so awesome.

00:53:43,909 --> 00:53:45,329
Call her about some consulting.

00:53:45,500 --> 00:53:47,630
Yeah, so I do executive coaching.

00:53:47,630 --> 00:53:49,539
So, it falls under a coaching piece.

00:53:49,570 --> 00:53:52,440
Um, I'm a speaker, so I speak on it.

00:53:52,469 --> 00:53:55,519
And then, um, I can train on it.

00:53:55,750 --> 00:54:03,550
Um, so right now in my target audiences are young professionals in the workplace who are, who are new, who, um, right.

00:54:03,550 --> 00:54:13,360
Like when it comes to public speaking, even or speaking up in a room of people who are older, more experienced, like having that confidence to show up authentically.

00:54:13,679 --> 00:54:20,855
Um, and so, but giving them the mindset that it's, you know, You don't have to, you're not, you don't have to be born confident.

00:54:21,045 --> 00:54:24,885
You don't have to wait till someone compliments you or praises you to feel confident.

00:54:24,894 --> 00:54:27,505
Like, you can do this for yourself, right?

00:54:27,514 --> 00:54:32,914
And so, if you, I mean, if you have that at a young age, I mean, that can carry you.

00:54:33,255 --> 00:54:33,485
Right.

00:54:33,485 --> 00:54:33,905
Do you, right?

00:54:33,905 --> 00:54:38,014
It's better to have it as young as possible and have that for the rest of your life.

00:54:38,344 --> 00:54:42,094
Um, but yeah, it's, confidence though isn't cockiness or, you know.

00:54:42,735 --> 00:54:44,135
Yeah, Self trust.

00:54:44,155 --> 00:54:49,784
And so we, um, people may appear confident, but really inside they're faking it.

00:54:49,885 --> 00:55:00,315
Um, and so you don't want that either, where you're just always like looking confident, but you're always like second guessing yourself and, you know, have imposter syndrome.

00:55:00,315 --> 00:55:06,094
So that's, like I said, is the promise is helping people have that for themselves.

00:55:06,304 --> 00:55:06,554
I like it.

00:55:06,554 --> 00:55:07,195
I like it.

00:55:07,195 --> 00:55:10,945
So they can have their own confidence superpower and model it for others.

00:55:10,965 --> 00:55:11,355
Cool.

00:55:11,690 --> 00:55:21,559
Like, did you kind of, starting at nine or whatever and beyond there, you just kind of were always confidence, or did somebody turn that switch, help you turn that switch?

00:55:21,559 --> 00:56:05,224
Yeah, so, with my father and the experiences he gave my siblings and I, the outdoor program, Experiences I think helped me set the foundation for my personal abilities and the confidence in that but like most people You know, I I questioned like my physical appearance So I always had small boobs and so that was like written I write about that in my book like being flat chested and being teased about that and you know how that you know lowered my self esteem and made me really self conscious and actually You It became a self conscious thing until in my 20s when I became a runner, and I was like, you know what?

00:56:05,304 --> 00:56:05,875
Running long distance.

00:56:05,875 --> 00:56:07,190
Nice, nice lugging those big jugs around.

00:56:07,190 --> 00:56:11,355
Yeah, and then I would hear people are complaining about back problems because, you know, their breasts are bigger.

00:56:11,355 --> 00:56:13,625
And I'm like, I was like, learned to appreciate it more.

00:56:13,625 --> 00:56:15,994
I was like, okay, this is actually a good thing for running.

00:56:15,994 --> 00:56:16,664
I was like, okay.

00:56:16,695 --> 00:56:18,625
So that was the kind of step one.

00:56:19,094 --> 00:56:22,784
And then I became a mom and I breastfed for a year.

00:56:23,034 --> 00:56:30,534
And then I, It was like, my, this is why my breasts were invented, like, I'm actually using them for their intended purpose.

00:56:30,775 --> 00:56:37,835
Society says, yeah, society says, I'm using them to attract people, right?

00:56:37,844 --> 00:56:42,574
Or, you know, it's like, Oh, like it's a sexual objectification.

00:56:42,804 --> 00:56:47,385
And that's, I should flaunt, you know, I read a lot of this Cosmos 17 magazine.

00:56:47,635 --> 00:56:50,518
And then I was like, you know what, all those messages that were told to me.

00:56:50,518 --> 00:56:51,505
And I was like, okay.

00:56:52,264 --> 00:56:53,344
Aren't even true.

00:56:53,425 --> 00:56:53,815
Right.

00:56:54,144 --> 00:56:56,295
Like that's just marketing and selling like.

00:56:56,574 --> 00:56:57,625
These are baby feeders, damn it.

00:56:57,704 --> 00:57:15,177
Yeah, and then Yeah, and so that's actually What happened is I just was like they served their purpose and it was something that a truth that I came across for myself Because society had been telling me I've been getting a lot of different messages my whole life.

00:57:15,177 --> 00:57:19,400
Well, we were in the age of Sports Illustrated, Cover Girls and all that I know.

00:57:19,530 --> 00:57:22,070
It was really in your face at that time.

00:57:23,210 --> 00:57:23,579
Yeah.

00:57:23,579 --> 00:57:27,599
And so, and so, that, but that didn't, I didn't become a mom until 30.

00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:27,940
Right.

00:57:28,019 --> 00:57:32,550
So, the confidence in that part of my body didn't really happen until then.

00:57:32,550 --> 00:57:34,070
And then I was like, it doesn't matter.

00:57:34,079 --> 00:57:39,119
But you were a dynamo at your long time employment after college and stuff like that already.

00:57:39,139 --> 00:57:42,300
So, you were confident in spaces, but not in your body.

00:57:43,820 --> 00:57:44,610
Holistically, we'll say.

00:57:45,150 --> 00:57:45,369
Yeah.

00:57:46,369 --> 00:57:48,599
I had, yes, some forms of confidence.

00:57:48,880 --> 00:57:53,730
But, um, another story to talk about in there is, you know, dating, right?

00:57:53,739 --> 00:57:58,920
Like, um, approaching the opposite sex if you're interested in them, right?

00:57:58,929 --> 00:58:02,480
That takes confidence to talk to someone that you're interested in.

00:58:02,480 --> 00:58:08,210
And I will say in our society, men have it harder because the pressure's on them to make the first move.

00:58:08,210 --> 00:58:29,565
But I asked a guy to prom in high school and it was I had lack of confidence, but I had, and then I gained confidence by just like talking myself out of it into it, actually talking myself out of the lack of confidence saying like, Hey, what would happen if you did, you know, and what really bad is going to happen if you don't exactly.

00:58:29,565 --> 00:58:33,255
I'm like, he said, no, I'm not going with anyone.

00:58:34,184 --> 00:58:35,744
We worked together grocery store.

00:58:35,744 --> 00:58:39,485
He was a stock boy and I was a cashier and it took me two weeks.

00:58:40,039 --> 00:58:43,059
To like, there were times I'd like say, okay, I'm gonna do it today.

00:58:43,059 --> 00:58:44,159
I'd see his truck in the parking lot.

00:58:44,159 --> 00:58:45,429
I'm gonna ask him today.

00:58:46,340 --> 00:58:48,250
And then I'm like, oh, I don't want to go back there.

00:58:48,250 --> 00:58:50,599
And I was like, I wanted no witnesses, right?

00:58:50,599 --> 00:58:53,010
I was like, cause rejection, like it hurts.

00:58:53,250 --> 00:58:55,349
So I was like, and I didn't want it spreading around.

00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:56,429
He was younger than me.

00:58:56,429 --> 00:59:00,880
So like asking like a sophomore to junior prom, I was like, oh no.

00:59:01,210 --> 00:59:06,114
Um, and then a lot of labels are probably put on women like, Oh, is she slutty?

00:59:06,125 --> 00:59:07,184
Is she forward?

00:59:07,195 --> 00:59:10,965
You know, all the, like, she's asking the boy, like, she's not supposed to do that.

00:59:11,275 --> 00:59:12,974
So I feel like there's lots of that now.

00:59:12,974 --> 00:59:21,025
But back then, like, I didn't want to be labeled for, you know, being slutty because I asked the boy to prom, but that was like a real fear.

00:59:21,025 --> 00:59:22,375
I mean, things like that happen.

00:59:22,385 --> 00:59:32,474
Well, you're in, I'm imagining Oklahoma is kind of like Texas and then it's like, On the surface, at least, they're very, uh, Bible thumping and holistic and Yes, yes.

00:59:32,474 --> 00:59:33,554
Not just on the surface.

00:59:35,934 --> 00:59:48,375
Um, and so, you know, so I feel like for women a lot of our lack of confidence comes from society's messages about what we should or shouldn't do, what we should look like, right?

00:59:48,684 --> 00:59:53,815
All of those things that we just accept as common truth, but they're not.

00:59:54,034 --> 01:00:03,309
And so, I was able to talk myself into asking him because basically I was like, well, he'll never going to say yes if I don't ask.

01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:05,190
And what's the worst that could happen?

01:00:05,190 --> 01:00:12,070
And like, I will be, you know, rejected in that moment, but hopefully he won't like blab about it and he didn't.

01:00:12,090 --> 01:00:13,949
I felt like I had a good judge of character.

01:00:14,269 --> 01:00:17,750
It was like, he doesn't seem the type to be gossipy and say stuff like that.

01:00:17,769 --> 01:00:19,159
And he never told anyone.

01:00:19,655 --> 01:00:22,605
And yeah, and it was good practice, right?

01:00:23,135 --> 01:00:26,925
It was like hard, but I did it and I was like, Oh, that wasn't so bad.

01:00:26,925 --> 01:00:31,804
I'm sure it's probably like the first time a guy asks a girl like, you know, you do it again.

01:00:32,045 --> 01:00:37,855
And then I met my husband in college and I was flirting with him and he did not get it.

01:00:37,934 --> 01:00:39,244
And I had to make the first move.

01:00:39,659 --> 01:00:43,480
Because, like, he was just, like, not Oblivious.

01:00:43,519 --> 01:00:44,269
Yeah, he was oblivious.

01:00:44,269 --> 01:00:48,210
He did not think I was interested, so I had to make the first move to let him know I was interested.

01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:49,530
So I What was that move?

01:00:49,880 --> 01:00:50,869
I sat on his lap.

01:00:50,869 --> 01:00:53,460
Oh! There you go.

01:00:54,099 --> 01:00:56,449
Right, you can't really, like, not know after that.

01:00:57,550 --> 01:01:01,949
So, um, he, like, liked me, and he asked me on a date.

01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:08,844
But I feel like That was practice for making this move in this situation and being the guy I married.

01:01:09,065 --> 01:01:14,474
So I feel like I've had, I've learned from Strong people in my life, men and women.

01:01:14,835 --> 01:01:23,114
Um, strong, I've always been attracted to entrepreneurs in that, you know, they like build something from scratch and they grow it and they do all these things.

01:01:23,405 --> 01:01:30,474
So I feel like, you know, I've always, um, been inspired to be like, yeah, I've been inspired to be like that.

01:01:30,505 --> 01:01:36,824
And just realizing that if you want something to happen, you got to do it yourself kind of mentality, not wait for it to happen for you.

01:01:36,824 --> 01:01:38,719
And in that case, I was like, Oh, yeah.

01:01:38,860 --> 01:01:42,610
Well, if I like this guy, I got to make a move.

01:01:43,750 --> 01:01:46,815
And so how did you how did you find your way here?

01:01:47,184 --> 01:01:52,054
Um, to Northern Colorado from Oklahoma and we'll, we're going to jump in the time machine after this.

01:01:52,054 --> 01:01:56,177
But I want to hear about the transplant of an established business down there, right?

01:01:56,177 --> 01:01:59,043
Like you had a big network and stuff like that.

01:01:59,043 --> 01:02:09,525
Uh, yeah, I was just going off referrals cause I have been, I went to the University of Oklahoma, suburb of Oklahoma City, started my business there and I, yeah, everyone knew me.

01:02:09,545 --> 01:02:14,695
Um, it was easy to, to serve because people knew who I was and what I was all about.

01:02:15,144 --> 01:02:44,289
But, um, So, my dad, having run the summer camp in southern Colorado, I've always, like, nature has been very important to me as a child, and Oklahoma had neither mountains nor beaches, so when, we always wanted to move either to Florida for the beaches, which you just came from there, the sun and the sand, and I'm born in the Philippines, so I say I have tropical blood, like the sun and the sand, like that's my roots, but then I grew up in the mountains of Colorado, so.

01:02:44,625 --> 01:02:54,224
We would vacation here a lot too, when our kids, we started them hiking when they were like two, and camping, and so we would vacation in Colorado, so it was really between those two places.

01:02:55,159 --> 01:03:01,579
And so I had my own business, my husband was working remotely so it was like time, my kids were old enough.

01:03:01,900 --> 01:03:06,679
It was time to, it was a good time in our lives and our careers to transplant.

01:03:06,980 --> 01:03:13,739
And so we ended up deciding on Colorado because there's more variety of outdoor adventures.

01:03:14,090 --> 01:03:20,369
So right, and the beach is kind of, yeah, and there's Everglades and there's other stuff but no hills.

01:03:20,369 --> 01:03:21,239
Mostly the same.

01:03:21,460 --> 01:03:23,599
But then here in Colorado.

01:03:23,940 --> 01:03:27,670
Um, we had tried mountain biking, so we were like, Ooh, we could become mountain bikers.

01:03:27,690 --> 01:03:29,989
We were already into hiking and backpacking.

01:03:30,380 --> 01:03:31,940
We enjoyed skiing.

01:03:32,260 --> 01:03:34,900
We've picked up snowshoeing since we've moved here.

01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:35,079
Bingo.

01:03:35,469 --> 01:03:35,989
Yeah.

01:03:36,280 --> 01:03:37,039
Rafting, things like that.

01:03:37,039 --> 01:03:37,610
Exactly.

01:03:37,619 --> 01:03:40,280
Oh yeah, do whitewater rafting, rock climbing.

01:03:40,289 --> 01:03:46,300
And so, so the mindset was like, Instead of vacationing there, wouldn't it be great to live there and raise our children in this area?

01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:47,769
environment every year.

01:03:48,829 --> 01:03:50,110
Yeah, exactly.

01:03:50,130 --> 01:03:58,159
As long as I get some beach in my life, which we're going to Mexico this summer is like, this is a better like more because I'm adventurous.

01:03:58,170 --> 01:04:00,679
It's like this has a lot more outdoor adventures here.

01:04:01,079 --> 01:04:11,630
And then we So Denver was out because we're not big city people, but we didn't want to live in the rural mountains and we wanted to be within an hour of a major airport since I do travel for work.

01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:18,159
And so, um, my husband Googled best places to live in Colorado and Fort Collins is on that list.

01:04:18,159 --> 01:04:18,530
Just like that.

01:04:18,789 --> 01:04:19,059
Yep.

01:04:19,099 --> 01:04:31,974
And we visited and for a week looked at houses at the end of the week and we're driving back to Oklahoma City and the house we bought, We ended up buying like popped up on Zillow, but offers were due the next day.

01:04:32,614 --> 01:04:33,385
So we bought it.

01:04:33,545 --> 01:04:42,175
We made an offer site and seen, but except for a video tour, um, and so it all worked out and then we had sold our house and bought that house within a month.

01:04:42,284 --> 01:04:42,764
Oh wow.

01:04:42,835 --> 01:04:43,155
Yeah.

01:04:43,164 --> 01:04:45,034
So everything happens for a reason.

01:04:45,045 --> 01:04:45,065
Yeah.

01:04:46,184 --> 01:04:46,985
Thank you.

01:04:46,985 --> 01:04:47,945
How did we get acquainted?

01:04:48,559 --> 01:04:49,119
Do you remember?

01:04:49,280 --> 01:04:54,219
Uh, we met at the appreciation event put on by the city of Fort Collins.

01:04:54,219 --> 01:04:54,809
Oh, yeah, that's right.

01:04:54,809 --> 01:04:58,219
That was coincidental that your business card had that.

01:04:58,360 --> 01:04:59,619
Love to appreciate stuff all over.

01:04:59,679 --> 01:05:06,675
I know! And someone I had met, um, Suggested I go to that because they knew I was all about appreciation.

01:05:07,525 --> 01:05:09,945
I think it would be interested in this event.

01:05:10,364 --> 01:05:14,014
So did you contact city of Fort Collins after that and say, Hey, you could do this better?

01:05:14,014 --> 01:05:17,585
Yeah.

01:05:18,744 --> 01:05:20,105
I'm like, Hey, you know that event?

01:05:20,144 --> 01:05:21,664
And I went this year, so I've been twice.

01:05:21,664 --> 01:05:23,264
Like, Hey, let's step it up a notch.

01:05:23,295 --> 01:05:23,594
Yeah.

01:05:24,085 --> 01:05:24,585
Fair enough.

01:05:24,704 --> 01:05:31,000
Are you, uh, Ready to jump in the time machine and go back to Oklahoma at five years old?

01:05:31,570 --> 01:05:33,003
Well, I was in the Philippines at five years old.

01:05:33,003 --> 01:05:33,909
Oh, Philippines at five years old.

01:05:33,909 --> 01:05:35,429
Yeah, let's talk about that, actually.

01:05:35,460 --> 01:05:38,019
Um, but let's take a quick break and we'll come right back.

01:05:38,469 --> 01:05:38,769
Okay, sounds good.

01:06:22,974 --> 01:06:28,155
So, you were born in the Philippines and at least past five you were there.

01:06:28,155 --> 01:06:28,985
Tell me about the Philippines.

01:06:28,985 --> 01:06:29,394
Mm hmm.

01:06:29,815 --> 01:06:31,344
In the circumstance, I suppose.

01:06:31,414 --> 01:06:32,965
Okay, so my father is in the U.

01:06:32,965 --> 01:06:33,125
S.

01:06:33,125 --> 01:06:35,534
Navy, and he met my mother, who's Filipino.

01:06:35,985 --> 01:06:40,775
And, um, yep, it was a great, a great island life.

01:06:41,255 --> 01:06:42,784
Can you tell me, like, were you in a city?

01:06:42,945 --> 01:06:44,994
We were in a small city.

01:06:45,014 --> 01:06:45,105
Okay.

01:06:45,195 --> 01:06:50,065
Um, and so, but we were then walking distance of the beach.

01:06:50,335 --> 01:06:53,755
Um, and, uh, we had a lot of family.

01:06:54,150 --> 01:06:57,139
And we had a bigger house because my dad made U.

01:06:57,139 --> 01:06:57,300
S.

01:06:57,300 --> 01:06:57,780
dollars.

01:06:57,780 --> 01:07:00,809
Yeah, your dad was like stationed there for quite a while and whatever.

01:07:00,880 --> 01:07:03,869
So we had a maid and he would be gone for months at a time.

01:07:04,090 --> 01:07:04,650
Right, right.

01:07:04,650 --> 01:07:06,039
I have four siblings.

01:07:06,199 --> 01:07:06,570
Oh, wow.

01:07:06,590 --> 01:07:07,000
Yeah.

01:07:07,139 --> 01:07:07,400
Okay.

01:07:07,780 --> 01:07:08,190
Older, younger?

01:07:09,085 --> 01:07:10,144
I'm the second youngest.

01:07:10,224 --> 01:07:10,494
Okay.

01:07:10,494 --> 01:07:10,735
Yes.

01:07:10,744 --> 01:07:11,635
And most are older.

01:07:12,034 --> 01:07:17,065
And, uh, we're all, we all have the same mom and, but we're all adopted by my dad.

01:07:17,065 --> 01:07:22,284
So two of us are the biological children of my father, but he adopted the other three.

01:07:22,355 --> 01:07:22,764
I see.

01:07:22,766 --> 01:07:22,945
I see.

01:07:22,945 --> 01:07:25,355
So, and we're very, very tight.

01:07:25,434 --> 01:07:27,635
Um, we don't not use the term half siblings.

01:07:27,914 --> 01:07:28,079
Right, right.

01:07:28,079 --> 01:07:29,175
We do not see each other that way.

01:07:29,175 --> 01:07:29,434
Doesn't matter.

01:07:29,434 --> 01:07:29,565
Yeah.

01:07:29,565 --> 01:07:30,735
We were raised together.

01:07:30,744 --> 01:07:31,414
We love each other.

01:07:31,414 --> 01:07:32,934
They're all, he's dad for everybody.

01:07:32,985 --> 01:07:33,835
Exactly.

01:07:34,125 --> 01:07:36,815
And, uh, we had a really comfortable life.

01:07:37,025 --> 01:07:37,454
He knows.

01:07:37,789 --> 01:07:39,460
Going to school and playing.

01:07:39,650 --> 01:07:42,440
So your mom had three little kids, right?

01:07:42,489 --> 01:07:43,739
When she met him?

01:07:44,969 --> 01:07:46,070
She was pregnant with the third.

01:07:46,130 --> 01:07:47,210
Pregnant with the third.

01:07:47,730 --> 01:07:55,099
Um, like that just sounds like a really interesting like, when you're a soldier serving in the Philippines, you're like, okay, looking for a single mom.

01:07:55,679 --> 01:07:56,150
You know?

01:07:57,039 --> 01:07:59,699
Uh, they just kind of clicked and it was just like that, or?

01:07:59,989 --> 01:08:05,869
Yeah, I actually don't know their love story, I don't, yeah, but I know he really loved her.

01:08:05,880 --> 01:08:06,170
Right.

01:08:06,190 --> 01:08:14,869
Um, but yeah, I don't know the circumstances, how they met, um, and I've heard different stories from family members, but then when they tell it, they don't really know either.

01:08:15,179 --> 01:08:15,260
Fair enough.

01:08:15,260 --> 01:08:16,250
So, yeah.

01:08:16,609 --> 01:08:17,109
Um, but.

01:08:17,109 --> 01:08:19,619
So anyway, so you were, you had living the dream there, right?

01:08:19,621 --> 01:08:20,000
Mm hmm.

01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:22,119
You got little kids, a maid, beach time.

01:08:22,729 --> 01:08:23,539
But you're a seven.

01:08:23,539 --> 01:08:24,340
Yeah, yes.

01:08:24,390 --> 01:08:25,979
And what, so can you speak Filipino?

01:08:25,979 --> 01:08:30,675
Yes, Is that your native language, or because you were raised, like, on an American base ish?

01:08:30,676 --> 01:08:52,625
It's Tagalog, and yes, I spoke it fluently, I knew a little bit of English, because they do teach it in the schools, and then when my dad was home, he would make us speak English to him, knowing we would eventually move back to the United States, um, and so he wanted us to speak English well, and, um, but then he was murdered.

01:08:53,114 --> 01:08:55,875
And it was, it's an unsolved mystery.

01:08:55,885 --> 01:08:56,755
In the Philippines?

01:08:56,795 --> 01:08:57,414
Mm hmm.

01:08:57,654 --> 01:08:58,185
Oh, wow.

01:08:58,204 --> 01:08:58,664
Mm hmm.

01:08:59,145 --> 01:09:03,534
And it was right before we were going to move to the United States anyways.

01:09:03,555 --> 01:09:04,104
Wow.

01:09:04,114 --> 01:09:05,524
So, um.

01:09:05,555 --> 01:09:06,395
And you have no idea.

01:09:06,395 --> 01:09:07,805
It wasn't your mom.

01:09:08,625 --> 01:09:09,494
Just kidding, I'm sure it's not.

01:09:10,045 --> 01:09:12,564
No, um, actually she was a suspect.

01:09:12,614 --> 01:09:13,175
Oh really?

01:09:14,295 --> 01:09:16,744
Supposedly for life insurance money.

01:09:16,795 --> 01:09:17,234
Oh my.

01:09:17,574 --> 01:09:19,284
Um, but it was never proven.

01:09:19,585 --> 01:09:24,814
And since you were going to the United States anyways, his parents came and took us five children.

01:09:24,824 --> 01:09:26,335
All the paperwork was in order.

01:09:26,345 --> 01:09:27,404
Except for just a little bit.

01:09:28,390 --> 01:09:31,079
We moved in with my great grandparents.

01:09:31,090 --> 01:09:31,550
Whoa.

01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:36,569
Who had renovated their basement already in preparation of our arrival.

01:09:36,670 --> 01:09:37,100
Whoa.

01:09:37,119 --> 01:09:40,430
And my mother stayed because she was under investigation.

01:09:40,539 --> 01:09:40,930
Oh my.

01:09:41,390 --> 01:09:41,939
Yeah.

01:09:42,430 --> 01:09:42,710
How intense.

01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:46,824
And then Well, who is this guy you were talking about that took you Camping and stuff.

01:09:46,885 --> 01:09:48,694
You're not your dad dad.

01:09:48,694 --> 01:09:50,125
Yeah, he's my adopted father.

01:09:50,135 --> 01:09:50,425
Wow.

01:09:50,435 --> 01:09:50,704
Yeah.

01:09:50,715 --> 01:09:50,935
Okay.

01:09:51,034 --> 01:10:17,435
His name's John and my but call him dad And my mom's name is Robin and they were friends of the family Okay, and when my grandparents said oh, we don't have a vehicle big enough to take them to our house like they had a 15 passenger van and they my grandparents were neighbors with my mom's And, and that's how they connected us.

01:10:17,444 --> 01:10:23,364
So they met us at the Tulsa International Airport when we landed in Oklahoma to loan us their van.

01:10:23,364 --> 01:10:25,114
They're one of the first people to meet us.

01:10:25,475 --> 01:10:36,364
They didn't have children and they let my grandfather or guardian know that they would be open to taking all of us if we couldn't be placed with family members.

01:10:37,220 --> 01:10:39,850
So I have three uncles and an aunt.

01:10:39,880 --> 01:10:43,750
So there's some shuffling around of like, maybe you'll live here, maybe you'll live here.

01:10:43,750 --> 01:10:43,770
Wow.

01:10:44,510 --> 01:10:52,000
And Um, as in most And you're second youngest, so you're seven, barely old enough to really digest most of this.

01:10:52,060 --> 01:10:52,260
Yes.

01:10:52,260 --> 01:10:53,449
How old was your oldest sibling?

01:10:53,520 --> 01:10:54,439
Uh, 17.

01:10:55,569 --> 01:10:55,840
Oh.

01:10:55,890 --> 01:11:02,359
My brother was 17, my sister was 13, and then my sister was 11, and then my brother was 4.

01:11:02,550 --> 01:11:05,180
Wow, what a fascinating arrival.

01:11:05,180 --> 01:11:05,800
Yeah.

01:11:05,800 --> 01:11:10,279
And as it is, you know, like with foster kids, it's harder to place older kids.

01:11:10,280 --> 01:11:11,329
Right, right.

01:11:11,869 --> 01:11:12,319
Yes.

01:11:12,729 --> 01:11:17,774
So, um, My two oldest siblings moved in with John and Robin first.

01:11:18,194 --> 01:11:18,505
Yeah.

01:11:18,555 --> 01:11:21,234
And then my middle sister and then my youngest brother and I.

01:11:22,475 --> 01:11:27,935
And yeah, it all worked out because, um, they were my family.

01:11:27,935 --> 01:11:35,645
And so being separated was like being, you know, like there was already the, the crisis and your mom never left the Philippines.

01:11:35,645 --> 01:11:36,234
No.

01:11:36,234 --> 01:11:40,524
And she ended up dying of cancer before she could come over.

01:11:40,864 --> 01:11:57,359
So, um, That was unfortunate, but I always focus on the positive, which is, no it's okay, which is, my siblings and I, all five of us, were raised together, and I swear that is why we don't have, like, issues.

01:11:58,380 --> 01:11:58,640
Right?

01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:10,739
When you think of, like, the trauma that happened as a kid, you're like, I think we were, we stabilized because we had great adopted parents, and then we stayed, uh, As a family unit together.

01:12:10,840 --> 01:12:10,949
Yeah.

01:12:11,119 --> 01:12:17,850
Cause I, I mean, if I think back, I really think I would have been like, you know, traumatized even more just being separated.

01:12:18,170 --> 01:12:22,430
And so, um, my oldest sister was kind of like a surrogate mother.

01:12:22,619 --> 01:12:22,789
Right.

01:12:22,789 --> 01:12:25,119
Like she would bathe us and fix our hair, you know.

01:12:25,359 --> 01:12:27,449
So there was like that continuity.

01:12:27,510 --> 01:12:27,529
Yeah.

01:12:27,819 --> 01:12:28,100
Um.

01:12:28,100 --> 01:12:31,590
How old were John and Robyn when they adopted you?

01:12:32,755 --> 01:12:34,505
Uh, I think like early 30s.

01:12:34,555 --> 01:12:35,784
And they didn't have children otherwise.

01:12:35,795 --> 01:12:37,274
They didn't have children otherwise.

01:12:37,295 --> 01:12:37,814
They just took the whole kit.

01:12:37,824 --> 01:12:46,560
Yes, but they had this big house and it was right across from Phillips University in Enid, Oklahoma, and they were constantly taking in exchange students.

01:12:46,590 --> 01:12:51,430
Oh, they'd meet people who had like no place to live and they'd be like, come on in, we have a spare bedroom.

01:12:51,710 --> 01:12:53,819
That was just the kind of people they are.

01:12:54,100 --> 01:13:06,560
And so they were used to people like coming and going and you know, they were just very open with their home and their hearts and my dad always wanted to have kids, but then my mom like didn't want to have kids of her own.

01:13:06,869 --> 01:13:11,789
So she was open to adoption and and Thankfully she was open to five Right.

01:13:12,625 --> 01:13:12,835
How cool.

01:13:12,835 --> 01:13:13,704
And can you believe it?

01:13:13,704 --> 01:13:14,904
I had my own bedroom.

01:13:15,835 --> 01:13:16,074
That's awesome.

01:13:16,675 --> 01:13:22,404
Some of my siblings had to share, but I actually really enjoyed having my own bedroom though, so thankfully.

01:13:22,404 --> 01:13:26,994
Yeah, they had this house they renovated and um, it was a great place to grow up.

01:13:27,385 --> 01:13:29,529
Um, so And what kind of a kid were you like.

01:13:30,600 --> 01:13:34,319
I mean, you arrived with modest English skills, probably.

01:13:34,319 --> 01:13:34,810
Yes.

01:13:34,880 --> 01:13:36,960
Um, and all your siblings, too.

01:13:37,050 --> 01:13:37,369
Yep.

01:13:37,369 --> 01:13:39,550
And, like, did you adapt quickly?

01:13:39,579 --> 01:13:41,560
Pick up English quickly?

01:13:41,569 --> 01:13:42,880
Did you get good grades right away?

01:13:43,300 --> 01:13:49,390
Well, not right away, and my grandpa tells a story that it's because they put us in the class with a Spanish speaking kid.

01:13:49,399 --> 01:13:49,737
Oh, right.

01:13:49,737 --> 01:13:52,296
Well, they don't speak English, so put them over here.

01:13:52,296 --> 01:13:53,064
Yeah, they're brown.

01:13:53,064 --> 01:13:55,625
Put them Spanish speaking class.

01:13:55,635 --> 01:13:59,585
So we were like doing horribly and then he realized what happened.

01:13:59,755 --> 01:14:04,335
He probably didn't even realize, like the school administrator was like, I don't know any English, so put him in the Brown kids class.

01:14:05,225 --> 01:14:17,604
And then, so they put us in, you know, the English speaking class and, um, the young, so my, um, sister who's two years older, she and I picked up English the fastest, right?

01:14:17,604 --> 01:14:19,890
So, and, uh, And then my brother was four.

01:14:19,890 --> 01:14:23,289
So, I mean, he's learning and all, but I think it's interesting.

01:14:23,289 --> 01:14:29,529
So like we, um, my brother's too young to, um, remember much.

01:14:29,810 --> 01:14:41,479
And so he doesn't even remember speaking Tagalog, but my sister and I were fluent and we came here at seven and nine and we assimilated so well, we actually lost Tagalog and we have no accents.

01:14:41,750 --> 01:14:47,664
And then my two oldest siblings speak with an accent and they, um, Yeah.

01:14:47,664 --> 01:14:49,045
And they can still speak Tagalog.

01:14:49,045 --> 01:14:51,125
I would say your accent is Oklahoma.

01:14:52,194 --> 01:14:52,695
You think so?

01:14:52,695 --> 01:14:54,095
I have a twang?

01:14:54,095 --> 01:14:55,199
I don't know about that.

01:14:55,199 --> 01:14:55,564
A little bit.

01:14:55,564 --> 01:14:55,675
A little bit.

01:14:56,425 --> 01:15:10,284
And so, that, you know, it's kind of a pro and con, because I feel like I lost a language, which, you know, it's tied to my roots, which is a huge loss, but at the same time, it did make life easier, assimilating so well.

01:15:10,284 --> 01:15:14,435
And so, we all did, the younger we were, did better in school.

01:15:14,454 --> 01:15:16,425
It was harder for my oldest siblings.

01:15:16,425 --> 01:15:16,949
Yeah, yeah.

01:15:17,079 --> 01:15:18,699
to learn a language, right?

01:15:18,699 --> 01:15:20,210
You know, as you're older.

01:15:20,819 --> 01:15:26,010
Um, and so yeah, we assimilated really well to the fact that we lost the language.

01:15:26,020 --> 01:15:26,949
So, right.

01:15:26,949 --> 01:15:32,590
And you had all these adventures where your oldest siblings along on some of these adventures and things like that too.

01:15:32,600 --> 01:15:33,880
So really a cohesive unit.

01:15:34,414 --> 01:15:39,295
Yes, my oldest siblings would carry a lot of my stuff on my early backpacking trips.

01:15:39,664 --> 01:15:41,954
When you were still a 70 pounder, you needed a little help.

01:15:42,145 --> 01:15:44,954
When all I could carry was like a seeping bag and a water bottle.

01:15:45,284 --> 01:15:48,145
Or a canteen back in the day.

01:15:48,145 --> 01:15:48,494
Right.

01:15:49,005 --> 01:15:52,935
Um, so talk to me about like, uh, going off to college.

01:15:52,935 --> 01:15:54,845
Or did you, or what was your path?

01:15:55,064 --> 01:15:58,765
What high school years kind of, did you have decisions?

01:15:58,765 --> 01:15:59,164
Uh.

01:15:59,699 --> 01:16:04,069
Yeah, um, I looked at different, like I looked at University of Texas.

01:16:04,069 --> 01:16:05,699
I looked at Duke University.

01:16:05,770 --> 01:16:13,590
Um, my best friend was definitely going to OU and if I stayed in Oklahoma, OU, University of Oklahoma is definitely my choice.

01:16:13,930 --> 01:16:17,689
And I was already thinking that and then I went on a campus visit.

01:16:17,699 --> 01:16:24,324
My brother was attending and he, Um, you know, took me on a tour, I got to see his frat house.

01:16:24,435 --> 01:16:25,895
So another story.

01:16:25,914 --> 01:16:28,385
So I have a brother that I haven't even mentioned.

01:16:28,805 --> 01:16:32,494
And his name's Ochi and he's from Mongolia.

01:16:32,854 --> 01:16:35,085
So remember I told you my parents would open up their houses.

01:16:35,585 --> 01:16:45,064
So my dad met this man at the camp and he was, he worked for this other man who is an ambassador to the United Nations from Mongolia.

01:16:45,189 --> 01:16:51,010
And he said, yes, he would really like to have his oldest son, like, get his education in the United States.

01:16:51,011 --> 01:16:51,319
Yeah, yeah.

01:16:51,390 --> 01:16:54,220
And my dad was like, oh, he could come live with us.

01:16:54,649 --> 01:16:58,069
And he asked us kids, like, would you mind if this kid lived with us?

01:16:58,069 --> 01:16:59,720
And we're like, who are we to say no?

01:16:59,890 --> 01:17:00,899
Like, sure.

01:17:01,760 --> 01:17:02,920
Whose room is he going to stay in?

01:17:02,920 --> 01:17:03,149
Yeah.

01:17:03,149 --> 01:17:05,300
And his name is Ochirhu Dorjisarang.

01:17:05,359 --> 01:17:05,720
Okay.

01:17:05,880 --> 01:17:09,199
And he, yes, he's from Mongolia, full Mongolian.

01:17:09,479 --> 01:17:12,210
And he moved in with us in sixth grade.

01:17:12,520 --> 01:17:15,350
And Yeah, has been a part of our family.

01:17:15,439 --> 01:17:17,310
He has his own parents in Mongolia.

01:17:18,159 --> 01:17:57,560
They come here to visit or he visits them, but he's also like my brother because he's been a part of one of the young men in our leadership Northern Colorado group is from Nepal and Has a not too dissimilar story where he was like an exchange student Somewhere and fell into like living with this eccentric old guy that had never had any kids And that's his American father now because he put him through the rest of his education got him his master's his PhD Yeah, and you know he owes A lot of, and he's one of the brightest, uh, professor, economist people at CSU, you know?

01:17:57,560 --> 01:18:00,430
And it's like, it changed his life in a similar way.

01:18:00,569 --> 01:18:02,779
Yeah, well, Ochi became valedictorian of our high school.

01:18:03,010 --> 01:18:04,560
Right, yeah, there's another one, right.

01:18:04,560 --> 01:18:05,029
I know.

01:18:05,369 --> 01:18:11,859
Um, so anyways, Ochi was attending OU and I did a campus visit and I was like, Wow, I belong here.

01:18:11,970 --> 01:18:13,579
Like, this is an amazing campus.

01:18:13,579 --> 01:18:14,960
How far away is this from where you were growing up?

01:18:15,159 --> 01:18:16,210
Uh, about two hours.

01:18:16,210 --> 01:18:16,430
Okay.

01:18:16,470 --> 01:18:17,850
From Enid, Oklahoma.

01:18:17,899 --> 01:18:19,390
So, far enough away.

01:18:19,430 --> 01:18:19,539
Right.

01:18:19,710 --> 01:18:20,289
But, well, you know.

01:18:20,739 --> 01:18:21,869
Easy to come home for the weekend if you want to.

01:18:21,869 --> 01:18:22,289
Yes, yes.

01:18:22,289 --> 01:18:26,590
And my roommate, best friend, and I roomed together, so that was great.

01:18:26,859 --> 01:18:34,954
And then we, uh, Did rush, but we specifically said let's not be in the same sorority because we need to branch out, right?

01:18:35,795 --> 01:18:50,795
You know, we were just like, okay, we don't need to do everything together But then our sororities ended up being next door to each other and there was a hedge in the bushes We would like go through and don't tell anyone but we would give each other codes to get into each other's house Just go to my room.

01:18:50,805 --> 01:18:57,409
I'll wait for you there Um, so it was yeah, it was I I Oh, you was one of the highlights of my life.

01:18:57,409 --> 01:18:59,289
Not just because I met my husband there.

01:18:59,539 --> 01:19:00,520
Um, the net.

01:19:00,550 --> 01:19:02,390
We won the football national championship.

01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:03,340
I was a student.

01:19:03,359 --> 01:19:06,350
I was part of the football recruitment team.

01:19:06,369 --> 01:19:06,750
Oh, wow.

01:19:06,800 --> 01:19:11,229
Um, I mostly did it for tickets to free tickets to the games and stuff.

01:19:11,230 --> 01:19:11,457
Yeah.

01:19:11,457 --> 01:19:13,340
But then you thought it was actually pretty cool.

01:19:13,340 --> 01:19:14,989
But it was really fun for like six months.

01:19:14,990 --> 01:19:22,369
And we're gonna be talking about the school spirit and you know, telling, cause basically, I mean, I was a campus leader, so just telling recruits like what a great university OU was.

01:19:22,430 --> 01:19:25,529
I didn't even have, I mean, we didn't talk football, we talked campus.

01:19:25,530 --> 01:19:27,300
Well, you're enthusiastic regardless of what you're talking about it seems like.

01:19:27,399 --> 01:19:28,789
What were you going to school for?

01:19:28,810 --> 01:19:34,460
So I picked my major when I was a junior cause I, um, it was public relations.

01:19:34,460 --> 01:19:39,170
I thought I wanted to go to broadcast journalism, but see here's a lack of confidence thing.

01:19:39,171 --> 01:19:40,594
Not have big enough boobs.

01:19:40,594 --> 01:19:42,016
No, it was my hair.

01:19:42,016 --> 01:19:42,586
Oh, okay.

01:19:42,586 --> 01:19:43,439
So I have.

01:19:43,819 --> 01:19:48,060
My hair is really short right now, but it's very curly and kind of frizzy.

01:19:48,119 --> 01:19:52,560
And I was like, I can't have frizzy hair on TV.

01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:55,199
Like no one looked like me who was on TV.

01:19:55,199 --> 01:19:55,479
Right.

01:19:55,479 --> 01:19:59,449
They always have like sleek, straightened hair, you know, we're like perfect curls.

01:19:59,680 --> 01:20:02,529
So I was like, Oh, I, so that was a lack of confidence.

01:20:02,529 --> 01:20:04,829
Like, I don't know if I could be on TV if they'd pick me.

01:20:04,829 --> 01:20:06,630
Cause I don't look like these other women.

01:20:06,979 --> 01:20:09,319
But in my dad was like, Hey.

01:20:09,625 --> 01:20:11,454
You should look into public relations.

01:20:11,475 --> 01:20:13,604
And then I like checked out a book from the library.

01:20:13,625 --> 01:20:16,104
Cause I'm a learner.

01:20:16,324 --> 01:20:16,664
Yes.

01:20:16,664 --> 01:20:17,555
I could research it.

01:20:17,555 --> 01:20:23,045
And I was like, yes, this is like, has all the similarities of journalism without actually, well, as it turns out.

01:20:24,090 --> 01:20:24,170
Yeah.

01:20:24,170 --> 01:20:28,850
Broadcast journalism hasn't been a growing career field in those years since then.

01:20:28,890 --> 01:20:29,319
Yeah.

01:20:29,320 --> 01:20:31,170
I mean, there's way less reporters.

01:20:31,170 --> 01:20:32,460
Way less TV personalities.

01:20:32,710 --> 01:20:33,765
All that there used to be.

01:20:33,765 --> 01:20:34,979
Well, and the news industry in general has shrunk.

01:20:35,380 --> 01:20:35,710
Right.

01:20:35,710 --> 01:20:36,489
It's kind of, yeah.

01:20:36,590 --> 01:20:36,840
Yeah.

01:20:36,859 --> 01:20:38,180
And they're all losing money still.

01:20:38,189 --> 01:20:38,409
Yeah.

01:20:38,479 --> 01:20:38,739
Yeah.

01:20:38,760 --> 01:20:41,010
Being replaced by awesome podcasts Yeah.

01:20:41,170 --> 01:20:43,250
Well, I'm glad you got here just the way you have it.

01:20:43,354 --> 01:20:43,675
Thank you.

01:20:43,676 --> 01:20:45,135
That's the way God made you.

01:20:45,135 --> 01:20:48,045
So, um, anyway, so I majored in journalism.

01:20:48,114 --> 01:20:48,784
I'm sorry for the boob cut.

01:20:48,854 --> 01:20:50,045
Um, that's okay.

01:20:51,034 --> 01:20:51,658
That too, right?

01:20:51,658 --> 01:20:52,547
I thought that's where you were going.

01:20:52,547 --> 01:20:53,545
I thought that's where you were going.

01:20:54,465 --> 01:20:57,095
Physical appearance is a, you know, an area of confidence.

01:20:57,335 --> 01:21:03,524
So I, it was actually, they made you journalism, uh, major in journalism, but it was an emphasis in public relations.

01:21:03,534 --> 01:21:04,060
So you had to do that.

01:21:04,229 --> 01:21:09,289
Take two years of journalism, and then you took your public relations courses, and I loved it.

01:21:09,319 --> 01:21:11,710
I thought it would start my own PR firm.

01:21:12,000 --> 01:21:17,170
Um, and then I decided I didn't want to be on call for crisis communications.

01:21:17,539 --> 01:21:20,689
Um, so I loved working in it.

01:21:20,750 --> 01:21:29,670
But, you know, because I was kind of thinking, I love what I do, but I'm also want to own my own business, but that was not the right business path for me.

01:21:29,670 --> 01:21:34,630
But I was always like on the lookout for like, yeah, you know, where, when, when did that start?

01:21:34,869 --> 01:21:39,170
Like why you weren't from an entrepreneurial family necessarily, right?

01:21:39,180 --> 01:21:39,729
No.

01:21:39,760 --> 01:21:40,229
Yeah.

01:21:40,250 --> 01:21:41,220
Um, I don't know.

01:21:41,220 --> 01:22:03,529
I think the more I just heard entrepreneurs speak as a young professional, uh, whether, if it, you know, as part of the leadership for young professionals or, Just different, you know, conferences were, you know, I remember attending a PR conference and there was a keynote speaker and he owned his own PR firm, but he would talk about how you like started that business.

01:22:03,750 --> 01:22:05,850
So that's the part I was kind of like clung onto.

01:22:05,869 --> 01:22:07,960
It's like, okay, could I do that?

01:22:08,619 --> 01:22:18,770
Um, and so it was just always in the back of my head, I think, but I really enjoyed, you know, I'm, I'm a words person and I'm a storyteller and I enjoy.

01:22:19,050 --> 01:22:20,149
working with people.

01:22:20,149 --> 01:22:22,869
And so that really fit all of that.

01:22:23,300 --> 01:22:27,949
You go right into that, um, kind of governmenty, kind of housing, affordable housing program then?

01:22:27,949 --> 01:22:28,289
Yes.

01:22:28,300 --> 01:22:32,289
So I was an intern, I had maybe six internships in college.

01:22:32,409 --> 01:22:32,850
Okay.

01:22:33,010 --> 01:22:34,760
Um, some were better than others.

01:22:35,189 --> 01:22:41,460
But that was really pushed on you to, um, get some experience, like real world experiences and variety.

01:22:41,770 --> 01:22:42,774
And so, um.

01:22:43,095 --> 01:22:53,444
I did an internship where I ended up getting a job, but it was about, I had to, it took me an extra semester to graduate because some classes were unavailable.

01:22:53,725 --> 01:23:01,984
So it was about, yeah, like nine months later after I stopped, had stopped interning and they just happened to have the job open up.

01:23:01,994 --> 01:23:09,194
I mean, there's only two people on the communications team, so it was just kind of by luck because, well, and they remembered you.

01:23:09,225 --> 01:23:09,635
Yeah.

01:23:09,635 --> 01:23:16,800
Well, and I ran into my, um, my, future boss in line at commencement because she was getting her master's degree.

01:23:16,819 --> 01:23:19,449
So, you know, it's just kind of funny how things work out.

01:23:19,479 --> 01:23:20,920
So she's like, hey, we have an opening.

01:23:20,920 --> 01:23:21,880
You should apply.

01:23:21,979 --> 01:23:22,371
Right, right.

01:23:22,371 --> 01:23:22,659
Yeah.

01:23:22,939 --> 01:23:27,479
Because I was, um, I was already thinking I would be getting my master's degree in Florida.

01:23:27,480 --> 01:23:28,868
That was kind of my next step.

01:23:28,868 --> 01:23:32,300
Were you, uh, were you already connected to your now husband?

01:23:33,500 --> 01:23:37,640
Yes, so then he started a business with his dad.

01:23:37,659 --> 01:23:40,090
It was a franchise called foot solutions.

01:23:40,659 --> 01:23:42,829
And he was starting that in Oklahoma city.

01:23:42,829 --> 01:23:45,670
So that kind of put my Florida plans on hold.

01:23:46,670 --> 01:23:47,939
We were pretty serious.

01:23:48,210 --> 01:23:49,539
And so I ended up.

01:23:49,725 --> 01:23:53,505
Applying for that job because I was going to be staying in Oklahoma City, right?

01:23:53,784 --> 01:23:56,534
And they ended up paying for my master's degree.

01:23:56,585 --> 01:24:01,585
Oh, yeah, so it all worked out there, too The foot solutions didn't work out good.

01:24:01,954 --> 01:24:02,244
Yeah.

01:24:02,244 --> 01:24:04,835
No, my husband really liked the work he did.

01:24:04,845 --> 01:24:11,585
He was a Pedorthist, so not a podiatrist, which is a good doctor, but he did custom orthotics.

01:24:11,685 --> 01:24:18,284
Actually, my PT guy told me I would really benefit from a small lift in my left foot, where my arch is not very strong.

01:24:18,295 --> 01:24:20,305
Yeah, so he did that.

01:24:20,305 --> 01:24:24,604
He wouldn't, and Analyze your gait, the shape of your foot, all these things.

01:24:24,604 --> 01:24:27,694
He had a machine too, and he would come up with a solution.

01:24:27,694 --> 01:24:33,385
So you wouldn't, you know, you wouldn't have foot pain and you hopefully wouldn't have to have foot surgery, which can be very complicated.

01:24:33,385 --> 01:24:35,984
Like sometimes they go well and sometimes they make it worse.

01:24:36,364 --> 01:24:41,524
And so, and he worked with people who had diabetes, so they had to have special shoes and things like that.

01:24:41,555 --> 01:24:48,465
He enjoyed the work, was helping people, was in high demand, but then on the business side of getting reimbursed.

01:24:49,000 --> 01:24:50,310
Oh, the insurance chase.

01:24:51,220 --> 01:24:51,970
He hated it.

01:24:51,989 --> 01:24:52,220
Right.

01:24:52,220 --> 01:24:53,199
It was really hard.

01:24:53,201 --> 01:24:53,600
I can't stand it either.

01:24:53,600 --> 01:24:53,930
Yeah.

01:24:53,939 --> 01:24:54,270
It's gross.

01:24:54,310 --> 01:25:11,680
And so he, um, went into private practice where he didn't reimburse through healthcare, he like shut down the franchise, did his own private practice, um, and then he got his master's degree in, um, math and computer science, so he's a software engineer now.

01:25:11,689 --> 01:25:12,069
Okay, gotcha.

01:25:12,070 --> 01:25:12,755
Yeah.

01:25:12,755 --> 01:25:29,265
So he was one of those, you know, when you choose your major, like in the minute, like down the road, and you have life experience, like you can, you can do, like, a much more targeted pick than when you're just in high school, like, I think I'll major in this.

01:25:29,444 --> 01:25:29,744
Right, right.

01:25:29,925 --> 01:25:30,922
No, I agree with that notion as well.

01:25:30,922 --> 01:25:31,364
He loves it.

01:25:31,604 --> 01:25:38,484
Yeah, and he already had ideas about working remotely, even back then, and he was like, that's something I could do as a software engineer.

01:25:38,494 --> 01:25:39,395
Right, yeah.

01:25:39,875 --> 01:25:41,305
Wasn't wanted that way even, probably.

01:25:41,335 --> 01:25:41,744
Mm hmm.

01:25:42,095 --> 01:25:55,090
Um, I feel like we kind of came full circle, like, I'm sure there was some learning lessons and journeys from that first job, but we kind of described already the, the launch from your career into self employment years.

01:25:55,170 --> 01:25:55,640
Yes.

01:25:55,909 --> 01:25:56,430
Yes.

01:25:56,750 --> 01:25:57,109
Um.

01:25:57,329 --> 01:25:58,500
Yeah, that is full circle, isn't it?

01:25:58,630 --> 01:26:01,720
We, uh, we always talk about faith, family, and politics.

01:26:01,720 --> 01:26:05,529
Would you like to continue on with family since you're talking about this sweet guy?

01:26:05,739 --> 01:26:05,909
Yeah.

01:26:06,170 --> 01:26:07,399
What's, uh, what's his name?

01:26:07,579 --> 01:26:08,539
His name's Kevin.

01:26:08,541 --> 01:26:08,659
Kevin.

01:26:08,659 --> 01:26:09,050
Kevin Jaeger.

01:26:09,069 --> 01:26:09,510
Hi, Kevin.

01:26:09,511 --> 01:26:09,689
Kevin Jaeger.

01:26:10,220 --> 01:26:10,685
Kevin Jaeger.

01:26:11,975 --> 01:26:14,074
Yes, so I didn't drop my name.

01:26:14,074 --> 01:26:15,774
I kept my maiden name and added his.

01:26:15,914 --> 01:26:16,414
Very good.

01:26:16,774 --> 01:26:28,984
And, uh, what would Kevin say was, aside from your obvious forwardness with sitting on his lap and stuff, but what was it that actually made him ask you out a second time or a third time?

01:26:30,475 --> 01:26:31,145
Oh.

01:26:32,345 --> 01:26:33,524
His favorite things about you.

01:26:33,534 --> 01:26:34,074
Yeah.

01:26:34,215 --> 01:26:34,515
What are some?

01:26:34,515 --> 01:26:37,875
Well, he says he liked, uh, That I was feisty.

01:26:38,925 --> 01:26:39,164
Well, you're definitely that.

01:26:40,305 --> 01:26:45,805
So I think he liked that I, yeah, I was like feisty, spunky, like up for a good time, like energetic.

01:26:45,805 --> 01:26:47,354
I think he liked that vibe.

01:26:48,664 --> 01:26:50,034
Is he a high energy guy too?

01:26:50,185 --> 01:26:51,404
No, no.

01:26:51,414 --> 01:26:53,095
It's more of a contrast to himself.

01:26:53,125 --> 01:26:54,515
Yes, and actually.

01:26:54,685 --> 01:26:55,835
Keeps life interesting kind of girl.

01:26:55,845 --> 01:27:23,699
Yeah, when we got serious, people, my friends were like, You know described us as like opposites attract and we have a lot in common, but there's also like differences So yes, I was more like the social like into campus activities Sure, he was more just doing his own thing like going to the gym His life is a lot more interesting because he has you Probably I do play in all of our all I say all most of our outdoor adventures But he loves to come along for the ride.

01:27:23,699 --> 01:27:26,260
So so Did you know him before?

01:27:26,454 --> 01:27:30,984
A little bit before you sat on his lap or was it pretty much just uh, that guy's cute.

01:27:30,984 --> 01:27:48,375
I think I'm gonna go for it No, I had some classes with them or something His fraternity and my sorority did this musical as part of the OU tradition It's called University sing and it was like skits and singing and dancing and it was The pledge classes of each one would come.

01:27:48,375 --> 01:27:50,215
So our fraternity and sorority were matched.

01:27:50,215 --> 01:27:51,765
So we'd have all these rehearsals.

01:27:52,175 --> 01:27:55,005
And so I started noticing him like, Oh, he's a cute guy.

01:27:55,215 --> 01:27:58,944
And then I noticed that he was wearing gym shorts and I was like, Ooh, he's athletic.

01:27:59,824 --> 01:28:02,654
It's like, that's, I like that because I'm adventurous.

01:28:02,835 --> 01:28:05,234
So that was like a good sign.

01:28:05,314 --> 01:28:09,725
And then there were, you know, they'd have parties and invite us over and.

01:28:10,250 --> 01:28:19,439
Anyway, and he wasn't like macking on all the girls too much and whatever making a fool of himself Yeah And so he was just really sweet and funny.

01:28:19,439 --> 01:28:26,095
And you know, I thought like Rubbing his arm and laughing at everything he said would do something, but he was clueless.

01:28:26,095 --> 01:28:30,194
I was like, how many parties do I have to go to?

01:28:30,194 --> 01:28:32,404
Like, this is like, taking too long.

01:28:34,805 --> 01:28:36,675
I've been warmed up for a couple weeks now.

01:28:37,215 --> 01:28:39,375
Yeah, so I've been like, eyeing him across the room.

01:28:39,375 --> 01:28:40,864
He wasn't my dance partner.

01:28:40,904 --> 01:28:41,494
Right, right.

01:28:41,494 --> 01:28:42,173
Fair enough.

01:28:42,173 --> 01:28:44,550
Um, you have a couple of littles?

01:28:44,920 --> 01:28:45,039
How many?

01:28:45,329 --> 01:28:46,069
Yeah, I have two sons.

01:28:46,119 --> 01:28:46,460
Okay.

01:28:46,500 --> 01:28:46,750
Yeah.

01:28:46,810 --> 01:28:48,789
And how old are they and what are their names?

01:28:49,130 --> 01:28:50,770
Their names are Aiden and Axel.

01:28:51,460 --> 01:28:51,819
Okay.

01:28:51,850 --> 01:28:52,220
Mm hmm.

01:28:52,300 --> 01:28:52,960
And how old?

01:28:53,140 --> 01:28:55,760
Oh, so Aiden is 11 and Axel's 7.

01:28:55,760 --> 01:28:56,510
Oh, wow.

01:28:56,510 --> 01:28:56,529
Yeah.

01:28:56,850 --> 01:29:01,859
Um, I don't know if you've listened to some of my past episodes, but we go for a one word description of the children.

01:29:02,260 --> 01:29:02,659
Mm.

01:29:02,899 --> 01:29:03,340
Okay.

01:29:03,341 --> 01:29:03,695
A lot of times.

01:29:03,695 --> 01:29:06,380
Uh, do you have a one word description for Aiden and Axel?

01:29:06,710 --> 01:29:07,979
Aiden is competitive.

01:29:08,140 --> 01:29:08,560
Okay.

01:29:09,600 --> 01:29:10,914
Axel is competitive.

01:29:12,404 --> 01:29:13,164
Adventurous.

01:29:13,166 --> 01:29:15,555
Wild.

01:29:15,555 --> 01:29:17,944
Wild.

01:29:18,125 --> 01:29:19,114
He's a wild card.

01:29:19,114 --> 01:29:20,185
How about wild card?

01:29:20,234 --> 01:29:20,805
There we go.

01:29:20,814 --> 01:29:21,425
Wild card.

01:29:21,426 --> 01:29:23,175
Like you just don't know what he's going to do.

01:29:23,175 --> 01:29:25,595
And he's into like putting himself in new situations.

01:29:26,534 --> 01:29:26,704
Yeah.

01:29:26,704 --> 01:29:27,625
He's a wild card.

01:29:27,725 --> 01:29:29,774
Sounds like a, my Schnauzer dog.

01:29:31,814 --> 01:29:34,765
Um, what, uh, what's Aiden up to?

01:29:34,774 --> 01:29:36,784
He's, uh, very competitive.

01:29:36,784 --> 01:29:38,755
Is he playing basketball or football?

01:29:38,944 --> 01:29:40,725
Yeah, he was playing basketball in the winter.

01:29:41,479 --> 01:29:48,050
Um, spring season, he's playing soccer and flag football and he, uh, flag football was not big in Oklahoma.

01:29:48,159 --> 01:29:49,470
It was all about tackle, right?

01:29:49,479 --> 01:29:51,229
I mean, it's like football country.

01:29:51,560 --> 01:29:53,689
And so it's really nice that there's a league here.

01:29:53,689 --> 01:29:56,569
It's really increased a lot here in the last maybe four or five years.

01:29:57,069 --> 01:30:02,564
Um, just because parents are like, No, I'm not going to let you have a concussion, or three.

01:30:02,904 --> 01:30:07,560
Yeah, and I've actually learned to appreciate the sport even more, because when I'm not distracted.

01:30:07,560 --> 01:30:09,045
Oh yeah, it's more dynamic in some ways.

01:30:09,045 --> 01:30:17,024
Yes, but I'm not, with all the violence and like, tackling, it's like I can appreciate the plays more, and the juking.

01:30:17,034 --> 01:30:18,104
Right, totally.

01:30:18,135 --> 01:30:19,395
And the, uh, moscow.

01:30:20,435 --> 01:30:22,074
I'm learning all these terms from my son.

01:30:22,074 --> 01:30:22,704
What's mossing?

01:30:22,744 --> 01:30:26,545
It's where you catch the ball behind someone, like they jump up to you, like you catch it.

01:30:26,545 --> 01:30:27,675
Oh, but you catch it above them.

01:30:28,055 --> 01:30:28,255
Yes, that's mossing.

01:30:28,784 --> 01:30:29,154
I like it.

01:30:29,194 --> 01:30:36,284
So, um, yeah, I see the athleticism it requires in other ways besides just being like brute force.

01:30:36,295 --> 01:30:36,885
Yeah, yeah.

01:30:37,164 --> 01:30:37,864
Tackling people.

01:30:38,005 --> 01:30:39,744
Are they, uh, small?

01:30:40,324 --> 01:30:42,024
Boys picking after their mom?

01:30:42,104 --> 01:30:44,694
Average, but yes, on the slender side.

01:30:44,704 --> 01:30:47,194
They're probably average height, but on the slender side.

01:30:47,585 --> 01:30:49,904
But yes, they're not going to be like But very determined.

01:30:50,015 --> 01:30:51,095
And huge.

01:30:51,635 --> 01:30:56,234
Yeah, so They will be centers, uh, more like wide receivers kind of thing.

01:30:56,265 --> 01:30:58,774
Yes, and yeah, that's the position they like a lot.

01:30:58,775 --> 01:30:59,895
Fair enough, fair enough.

01:31:00,314 --> 01:31:01,010
So, yeah, it's boring.

01:31:01,439 --> 01:31:04,029
So, anything else you want to say about family?

01:31:04,319 --> 01:31:07,079
I mean, what a, yeah, uh, interesting background.

01:31:07,130 --> 01:31:07,199
What?

01:31:07,199 --> 01:31:10,090
You want to say anything about, uh, John and Robin more?

01:31:10,210 --> 01:31:11,329
Um, Than you have already?

01:31:14,699 --> 01:31:15,930
Well, you're asking me, like, who do I talk to?

01:31:15,939 --> 01:31:16,680
Like, my kids?

01:31:16,699 --> 01:31:17,640
Like, my parents?

01:31:18,390 --> 01:31:35,060
Um, Well, actually, I think one thing I'll go back to when we were talking about my husband is I was saying, like, I noticed that he was wearing gym shorts, um, so part of, because this ties back to the confidence book, is I had a list of the qualities I wanted in a future husband.

01:31:35,060 --> 01:31:35,739
The clarity thing.

01:31:35,819 --> 01:31:37,100
Yes, exactly.

01:31:37,359 --> 01:31:37,390
Okay.

01:31:37,500 --> 01:31:39,310
And I think Big package was one of them.

01:31:40,550 --> 01:31:42,300
I couldn't tell that from doing this.

01:31:42,649 --> 01:31:43,710
Okay, I just asked you.

01:31:43,729 --> 01:31:44,949
They weren't windbreaker pants.

01:31:48,704 --> 01:31:58,564
I think that helps when you know the type of guy that you want, not just in physical appearance, but also in their qualities.

01:31:58,585 --> 01:32:07,194
And so when I found something, someone who like fit a lot of the criteria, it made it easier for me to make the move.

01:32:07,225 --> 01:32:07,515
Right.

01:32:07,524 --> 01:32:09,024
It wasn't just like some guy.

01:32:09,034 --> 01:32:10,154
I was like, okay.

01:32:10,175 --> 01:32:13,145
Like, you know, it was like in my head, I'm like mentally checking.

01:32:13,664 --> 01:32:15,194
I would say you're a very organized suspect.

01:32:15,215 --> 01:32:15,704
Yes.

01:32:17,494 --> 01:32:33,204
And, you know, you, and then some people I feel like who really don't have a type or haven't thought about it, and they're just dating all kinds, which is fine, but I think it takes you longer to find the one you're probably going to end up with, because you're kind of dating everyone.

01:32:33,395 --> 01:33:02,654
Um, that's just my personal experience, but I think it helped to create that clarity, and it gave me confidence, like I said, to make that move, because, Well, and I think if I may interrupt, and I'm sorry, but like, there's different kinds of thinkers like, like Alma and you, I suspect are very similar where like having that kind of list kind of thing is what can give you confidence to sit on somebody's lap or like she asked, she asked her now husband out when she was 16 and he was 19.

01:33:02,755 --> 01:33:03,555
Oh, wow.

01:33:04,475 --> 01:33:05,635
Right, exactly.

01:33:05,635 --> 01:33:06,564
It's a similar kind of thing.

01:33:06,854 --> 01:33:07,175
But.

01:33:07,484 --> 01:33:13,515
It was, I suspect, at least in part because she was kind of, had listed out some of the criteria of what she was looking for.

01:33:14,574 --> 01:33:16,814
For me, I'm a lot more instinctive.

01:33:16,814 --> 01:33:18,215
Like, I can have confidence, confidence, confidence.

01:33:18,664 --> 01:33:38,104
Kind of just in my gut But I'm kind of ADHD and I'm weaving together all the intuitions at all times Kind of and I just kind of operate that way if I had to sit down and make a list of 20 things I was looking for like I would procrastinate that until forever And then I just wouldn't do it.

01:33:38,164 --> 01:33:41,234
So anyway, it's different you know, what works for you, right?

01:33:41,234 --> 01:33:43,954
So there's clarity there for sure Yeah.

01:33:44,145 --> 01:33:56,805
No, I'm kind of best when, like if I'm, if I, I do a lot of volunteer emceeing, and if there's a really tight script that I really got to read along with the script, it's hard for me.

01:33:57,265 --> 01:34:06,194
If it's a loose script with bullet points and things like that, and I have a little bit more free flowing, well then I can just tie in and just feel a lot more comfortable.

01:34:06,195 --> 01:34:09,765
Uh, whereas some people, you know, an outline.

01:34:10,335 --> 01:34:11,095
It's not a script.

01:34:11,095 --> 01:34:11,984
Like, don't give me that.

01:34:11,984 --> 01:34:12,704
I'm not prepared.

01:34:12,715 --> 01:34:13,275
That's a good point.

01:34:13,275 --> 01:34:13,515
Yeah.

01:34:13,515 --> 01:34:14,715
I have to memorize this.

01:34:14,715 --> 01:34:16,814
So it really depends on the personality, I think.

01:34:17,104 --> 01:34:17,734
Anyway, I digress.

01:34:17,734 --> 01:34:18,064
That's a good point.

01:34:18,404 --> 01:34:21,465
Um, so, more you want to talk about, uh, with, uh, Kevin?

01:34:21,465 --> 01:34:25,954
Um, yeah, with my, um, no, let's just switch to, yeah, my adopted parents.

01:34:25,965 --> 01:34:29,295
Um, they, they were great role models for me.

01:34:29,305 --> 01:34:31,635
My mother ran triathlons.

01:34:31,645 --> 01:34:31,675
Oh, wow.

01:34:31,685 --> 01:34:34,515
And so just seeing, you know, that.

01:34:34,564 --> 01:34:34,914
Yeah.

01:34:34,975 --> 01:34:35,425
Yeah.

01:34:35,524 --> 01:34:38,880
Well, In those days, it was probably much more rare.

01:34:39,029 --> 01:34:39,529
Mm hmm.

01:34:39,529 --> 01:34:40,479
I think so, yes.

01:34:40,550 --> 01:34:42,810
I suspect, you know, I never really heard about that.

01:34:42,840 --> 01:34:43,149
Yeah.

01:34:43,369 --> 01:34:46,840
I mean, what's his name, David Jenner and those kind of guys way back in the day.

01:34:47,600 --> 01:34:48,590
Not that you're as old as I am.

01:34:49,789 --> 01:34:51,409
But yes, um, But a big inspiration.

01:34:52,180 --> 01:35:01,850
Uh, and so she was modeling kind of like healthy behaviors and having a hobby and a passion that even when you're a busy mom that you make time for.

01:35:01,890 --> 01:35:01,909
Yeah.

01:35:02,310 --> 01:35:05,859
Um, and so, and she made us eat healthy.

01:35:06,130 --> 01:35:07,380
I feel like that has really helped.

01:35:07,930 --> 01:35:09,340
It's a big part of who I am.

01:35:09,359 --> 01:35:09,409
For sure.

01:35:10,770 --> 01:35:23,869
Part some in my health habits that I've developed like we only had pop in the house whenever we had birthday parties So yeah, but they also at the same time didn't speak about the evils of pop because that would just make us want it more Right, right.

01:35:23,869 --> 01:35:25,630
So they weren't like pop is bad.

01:35:25,640 --> 01:35:26,779
That's why we don't have it.

01:35:26,779 --> 01:35:31,189
They just was like we just didn't buy it Yeah, so if you're thirsty, there's milk.

01:35:31,210 --> 01:35:46,015
There's orange juice and there's water You know, um, and then my dad he um You Always led, um, outdoor, like, trips, um, like I, I've mentioned, but he was also our youth group leader and our youth choir director.

01:35:46,295 --> 01:35:47,704
So, man, we spent a lot of time with him.

01:35:49,295 --> 01:35:51,664
Not just as our dad, but in a lot of the activities.

01:35:51,666 --> 01:35:52,988
Right, super engaged all the time.

01:35:52,988 --> 01:35:59,875
Yes, yes, and, um, and see, that's why it worked out, um, with the five, with the five children, because he was already doing stuff with youth groups.

01:35:59,875 --> 01:36:04,414
So, I mean, it was just like, he, like, wanted, you know, his own kids and, nice.

01:36:04,649 --> 01:36:10,989
As, in his family, because he's always, um, loved being around children and mentoring them.

01:36:10,989 --> 01:36:11,729
Yeah, yeah.

01:36:11,930 --> 01:36:14,310
Taking them on really cool experiences.

01:36:14,340 --> 01:36:21,164
Have you stated any kind of connection, or otherwise, with your Biological dad's family?

01:36:21,465 --> 01:36:21,925
Yes.

01:36:22,015 --> 01:36:22,274
Yeah.

01:36:22,515 --> 01:36:22,975
Mm hmm.

01:36:23,135 --> 01:36:23,475
Yep.

01:36:24,194 --> 01:36:29,475
Um, like Christmas cards, you know, they came to my wedding.

01:36:29,505 --> 01:36:35,534
I have an uncle, um, right outside of Castle Rock that I meet up with every now and then.

01:36:35,534 --> 01:36:35,755
Yeah.

01:36:35,755 --> 01:36:37,664
And my cousin lives in Johnstown.

01:36:37,975 --> 01:36:38,545
So yes.

01:36:38,895 --> 01:36:46,984
Um, even though we were adopted, we always like visited different family members for sure.

01:36:47,005 --> 01:36:53,404
How about, um, have you ever been to Philippines and will you ever yes, I went back 20 years later.

01:36:53,404 --> 01:37:08,795
So it's 27 years old and okay Kevin went with me and We visited family for a week reconnected with some cousins and my aunt and she gave some photo albums Oh, yeah, and some personal items from my parents.

01:37:08,835 --> 01:37:09,194
Sure.

01:37:09,305 --> 01:37:16,954
So I Took that back and shared it with my siblings and that was really great because we left in a hurry and didn't have a lot of stuff.

01:37:16,956 --> 01:37:17,734
Right, right.

01:37:17,774 --> 01:37:21,255
And, um, and then we scuba dived for a week.

01:37:21,475 --> 01:37:21,715
Oh, cool.

01:37:21,715 --> 01:37:28,185
On the Palawan Islands and got our open water certification and advanced open water certification and that was really cool.

01:37:29,345 --> 01:37:36,125
So if you don't know, the Philippines is a top 10 destination for scuba diving because there's sunken World War II ships off the coast.

01:37:36,135 --> 01:37:36,744
Oh, right.

01:37:37,024 --> 01:37:40,895
Some are narrow, or narrow, some are shallow, and some are very deep.

01:37:40,935 --> 01:37:41,064
Okay.

01:37:41,215 --> 01:37:43,104
And so for one of them, that's how we got her.

01:37:43,409 --> 01:37:44,550
Deep dive.

01:37:44,550 --> 01:37:44,890
Deep water certification.

01:37:44,890 --> 01:37:46,640
Yeah, certification is that.

01:37:46,649 --> 01:37:46,739
Interesting.

01:37:46,909 --> 01:37:50,949
And then our, we just, it was just the two of us with our one instructor.

01:37:51,600 --> 01:37:56,140
And he said, I'm not supposed to do this because you haven't been cave certified.

01:37:56,369 --> 01:37:59,390
But he took us inside one of the ships.

01:37:59,390 --> 01:37:59,409
Whoa.

01:37:59,420 --> 01:38:01,039
He's like, I, you know, he'd been.

01:38:01,279 --> 01:38:01,569
Right.

01:38:01,779 --> 01:38:08,119
I've been diving in it for days, yeah, and he could just tell, like, we're cool and aren't gonna freak out in an enclosed space.

01:38:08,149 --> 01:38:08,670
Right, right.

01:38:08,670 --> 01:38:11,180
And so he took us inside and that was pretty cool.

01:38:11,180 --> 01:38:11,220
I bet.

01:38:11,699 --> 01:38:11,930
Yeah.

01:38:11,930 --> 01:38:12,551
I bet.

01:38:12,551 --> 01:38:14,409
Do you still scuba dive regularly?

01:38:14,409 --> 01:38:14,720
No.

01:38:14,720 --> 01:38:15,649
Not so much?

01:38:15,649 --> 01:38:18,210
But I wanna, like, I've forgotten everything.

01:38:18,210 --> 01:38:20,327
I would have to re Go get re certified.

01:38:20,327 --> 01:38:26,909
But it's funny, even after we got our advanced open water certification, I was like, there is no hell I would do this on my own.

01:38:26,911 --> 01:38:27,289
Right.

01:38:27,289 --> 01:38:35,284
I mean, there's just, like, Too much to remember, too much to go wrong, and I was like, no, I will always have an instructor with me.

01:38:35,484 --> 01:38:42,215
And, funny story, when on one of our dives, um, we were at the safety stop.

01:38:42,664 --> 01:38:43,354
Do you scuba dive?

01:38:43,354 --> 01:38:45,045
I've snorkeled some, but never scuba dived.

01:38:45,175 --> 01:38:49,005
Well, if you go deep enough, you have to just hang out kind of near the top.

01:38:49,006 --> 01:38:50,369
Right, before you can get the bends.

01:38:50,369 --> 01:38:50,760
Yes, exactly.

01:38:50,760 --> 01:38:56,079
So we're at the safety stop and there happened to be a rope from our boat going down to one of the ships just as a guide.

01:38:56,350 --> 01:39:03,534
And so we're just hanging out and I'm looking at all the fish and we get on the boat and Kevin was like I ran out of air.

01:39:03,604 --> 01:39:04,649
I was like, what?

01:39:04,649 --> 01:39:06,305
What was I doing?

01:39:06,305 --> 01:39:09,795
How did I not know this but you train for situations like this?

01:39:10,015 --> 01:39:24,395
So his spg that tells you how much air you have left in your tank It said he had air but he's sucking on his mouthpiece and like there was no air So he said like he um You know, pointed at it and to our instructor saying like, there's no air.

01:39:24,395 --> 01:39:26,555
And he looked at it and he was like, there's air.

01:39:26,854 --> 01:39:27,930
And then he said like, I can't breathe.

01:39:28,390 --> 01:39:35,609
But then he, my instructor said once he saw my Kevin's eyes bulge, he knew there was no air And so what did they do?

01:39:35,614 --> 01:39:40,564
So they have a second, the instructor has a second mouthpiece, and we had practiced that.

01:39:41,295 --> 01:39:42,395
Just this situation.

01:39:42,414 --> 01:39:45,265
And so Kevin took the second mouthpiece and all was well.

01:39:45,524 --> 01:39:49,305
And so he handled it like a pro, like something went wrong.

01:39:50,364 --> 01:39:52,395
He, he did what he was supposed to do.

01:39:52,395 --> 01:39:59,494
And here I was in La La Land looking all the fish, did not even know this crisis was going on around me, but things like that can happen.

01:39:59,975 --> 01:40:00,494
Oh yeah.

01:40:00,574 --> 01:40:02,465
And I don't want to be just me and Kevin.

01:40:02,465 --> 01:40:06,045
And we're, I mean, 20 feet away is almost too far away in the water.

01:40:06,074 --> 01:40:21,510
You're like, yeah, my wife and I went to Hawaii for our 20th, This last May, and when we were in Lanai, we went snorkeling and as we're snorkeling, Jill like waved over to me and said, Hey, there's a dollar bill on the ocean floor here.

01:40:22,579 --> 01:40:24,060
And I was like, cool.

01:40:24,060 --> 01:40:29,770
And I had just learned how to dive snorkeling, which is kind of hard to get below the surface, but, but I managed to do it.

01:40:29,770 --> 01:40:45,099
And then I swam like, 12 feet down to the ocean floor, got the dollar bill, came up victoriously to the surface, and Jill was 40 yards away, looking at other fish, and I was like, baby, I got the dollar! Be proud of me! That's right, yeah.

01:40:45,099 --> 01:40:46,578
Anyway, I digress.

01:40:46,578 --> 01:40:47,069
Yeah.

01:40:47,250 --> 01:40:49,090
Good for you, 12 feet is a deep dive.

01:40:49,090 --> 01:40:49,949
It was hard.

01:40:49,960 --> 01:40:54,039
Like, I was pushing to get down there, but I had a dollar at the end of that journey.

01:40:54,041 --> 01:40:55,532
We know it motivates you.

01:40:55,532 --> 01:40:56,189
I needed something.

01:40:56,750 --> 01:40:58,390
Um, so that was fun.

01:40:58,390 --> 01:40:58,770
family.

01:40:58,770 --> 01:41:00,029
I think we covered that pretty good.

01:41:00,039 --> 01:41:01,829
Do you want to talk about faith or politics?

01:41:02,149 --> 01:41:03,399
Um, sure.

01:41:03,409 --> 01:41:04,000
It depends.

01:41:04,350 --> 01:41:05,109
Where do you want to start?

01:41:05,539 --> 01:41:08,659
I, you know, I, I use faith because it's kind of a generalized term.

01:41:08,920 --> 01:41:09,050
Yeah.

01:41:09,050 --> 01:41:11,220
I mean, I grew up in the church.

01:41:11,250 --> 01:41:15,460
Um, one of my role models, role models, we had a female pastor.

01:41:15,479 --> 01:41:22,279
And so just even then as a young girl, yes, I was like, this is not common in Oklahoma.

01:41:22,279 --> 01:41:23,609
There are churches that forbid that.

01:41:24,229 --> 01:41:28,079
So, um, You know, that was just great to grow up in that environment.

01:41:28,079 --> 01:41:33,520
And I mentioned my dad was the Youth Choir Director and the Youth, um, Youth Group Director.

01:41:33,640 --> 01:41:39,739
So And the, and the camp was also, was it church associated too, the Um, well Loosely.

01:41:39,739 --> 01:41:41,020
Loosely, yeah.

01:41:41,079 --> 01:41:41,189
Fair.

01:41:41,220 --> 01:41:46,369
Because Phillips University, it was their science camp and they had a theological seminary.

01:41:46,529 --> 01:41:49,239
So yeah, it was loosely, but it was mostly a science camp.

01:41:49,539 --> 01:41:55,954
And, um, So, and it was right across the street from our house, I mean, we were like there back and forth all the time.

01:41:55,994 --> 01:41:56,244
Right.

01:41:56,255 --> 01:42:02,515
Sunday school, my dad had his seminary degree, but he didn't become a pastor of his own church until high school.

01:42:02,795 --> 01:42:08,125
So, I think it's funny, and I watched the movie Footloose, but I was like, Oh yeah, I never thought of myself as a preacher's daughter.

01:42:09,385 --> 01:42:10,024
But kinda.

01:42:10,025 --> 01:42:10,539
Yeah.

01:42:11,569 --> 01:42:14,329
But my dad was not your average pastor.

01:42:14,340 --> 01:42:17,060
Like he was like, we didn't even have curfew.

01:42:17,060 --> 01:42:24,739
I mean, we had, you know, like we got in trouble if things happen, but he wasn't a big rules person and anyway, exactly.

01:42:24,739 --> 01:42:25,069
Yeah.

01:42:25,079 --> 01:42:28,100
You make your own decisions and stand with the consequences.

01:42:28,109 --> 01:42:30,430
We didn't even, Locker house doors.

01:42:30,449 --> 01:42:33,560
My parents were like if someone wants to break in they'll just break a window.

01:42:33,560 --> 01:42:57,380
So they're gonna get in anyway I'm just you can kind of picture my parents five kids around But then, you know, my oldest brother was 17 so he kind of moved out like pretty soon after So, um, anyway, so the church has been a huge part of my life.

01:42:57,380 --> 01:42:58,359
I'm baptized.

01:42:58,640 --> 01:43:05,579
Um, I will say as an adult, I feel closest to, I am not a regular church go anymore.

01:43:05,590 --> 01:43:13,760
I feel closest to God when I'm in nature, like backpacking, like not just car camping, but like really deep woods, like under the stars.

01:43:13,760 --> 01:43:15,760
There's like no civilization.

01:43:16,220 --> 01:43:18,510
I feel like I can feel his presence the most.

01:43:18,710 --> 01:43:20,609
And secondly, when I volunteer.

01:43:20,895 --> 01:43:26,574
So I feel like I am connected in those two ways, through nature and giving back to others and serving others.

01:43:26,604 --> 01:43:30,085
What do you do, like, with the person of Christ?

01:43:30,085 --> 01:43:32,435
Like, would you consider yourself a Christian still?

01:43:32,625 --> 01:43:33,645
What do you think about Jesus?

01:43:33,914 --> 01:43:38,935
Um, yes, but more loosely than when I was growing up.

01:43:38,944 --> 01:43:39,454
Yeah, fair.

01:43:40,229 --> 01:43:41,350
You still think he's cool?

01:43:41,470 --> 01:43:41,970
Yeah.

01:43:43,390 --> 01:43:43,579
Okay.

01:43:43,579 --> 01:43:44,130
Yes.

01:43:44,170 --> 01:43:44,500
Yes.

01:43:44,529 --> 01:43:51,489
And your kids are kind of approaching that age where they're going to want to know more too or not?

01:43:51,539 --> 01:43:51,909
Yeah.

01:43:51,909 --> 01:43:56,399
Like, do you have them involved in any of those kind of young, youth activities or things like that?

01:43:56,399 --> 01:43:57,560
Not currently.

01:43:57,579 --> 01:44:01,930
And, you know, we address their questions and they ask, but they actually haven't asked a lot.

01:44:01,960 --> 01:44:02,819
No strong expression.

01:44:03,329 --> 01:44:03,590
Yeah.

01:44:03,590 --> 01:44:11,104
Well, culturally it's not, I mean, it's pretty uncommon, almost, anymore, it seems like, to have kids that are very engaged with their church.

01:44:11,125 --> 01:44:11,635
Mm hmm.

01:44:11,954 --> 01:44:17,274
Well, and when we moved to Fort Collins, there's not a church on every corner, like it is in Oklahoma.

01:44:17,564 --> 01:44:18,385
Yeah, there's still a lot of them, though.

01:44:18,484 --> 01:44:21,824
There's a lot, but it's, um, less Not the same.

01:44:21,824 --> 01:44:22,005
Yeah.

01:44:22,005 --> 01:44:24,154
There's not the same cultural expectation.

01:44:24,155 --> 01:44:24,175
Yes.

01:44:24,175 --> 01:44:24,635
Yes.

01:44:24,725 --> 01:44:31,090
Like, if you're, if you're applying for a board of directors role, um, In Fort Collins, nobody cares if you go to church or what church you go to.

01:44:31,119 --> 01:44:31,989
Exactly.

01:44:32,039 --> 01:44:34,619
It would be a different story probably in Texas or Oklahoma.

01:44:34,909 --> 01:44:40,399
It is a huge part of, um, people's, like, social identity and social belonging.

01:44:40,685 --> 01:44:58,015
Well, it's status, uh, establishment, interestingly, I've been listening recently to a podcast about that, like, in the old days, you know, even when your dad, or your adopted dad was in there, like, your status was somewhat established by how old Good of a Christian you were.

01:44:58,095 --> 01:44:59,095
Yes, that is true.

01:44:59,194 --> 01:45:17,864
And like in Fort Collins here, it's maybe a little bit more established on, you know, how innovative you are, how knowledgeable you are about beer culture, how strong your mountain biking game is, like status is definitely not established in the same way 30 years later, 40 years later as it was.

01:45:17,984 --> 01:45:18,444
Yeah.

01:45:18,564 --> 01:45:18,895
In that regard.

01:45:18,895 --> 01:45:20,244
Well, in running for office.

01:45:20,704 --> 01:45:21,055
Right.

01:45:21,064 --> 01:45:25,279
In Oklahoma, like, Yeah, you definitely couldn't if you were part of a strong church.

01:45:25,310 --> 01:45:29,050
Yeah, church are you affiliated with, because that's a huge part of your numbers.

01:45:29,130 --> 01:45:30,010
Totally, totally.

01:45:30,010 --> 01:45:33,539
Um, and so, I'm, I'm new here, but I feel like that isn't.

01:45:35,255 --> 01:45:36,734
No, I don't think so.

01:45:36,734 --> 01:45:43,085
Although like the Timberline church, definitely in the Presbyterian church, definitely have a lot of influential people.

01:45:43,604 --> 01:45:47,085
So if there's like in churches, those are maybe a couple of them.

01:45:47,125 --> 01:45:52,845
I tend to prefer like very small churches that don't have much dogma or power structure.

01:45:53,425 --> 01:45:55,375
Cause I'm just like an anti power guy period.

01:45:55,795 --> 01:45:57,984
Um, and so, you know, I haven't.

01:45:58,494 --> 01:46:08,354
been in that same space, but Colorado Springs, in contrast, it was all about, like all the, all the hootie hooties, uh, were at First Prez or this other St.

01:46:08,354 --> 01:46:09,555
Joseph's or this and that.

01:46:09,555 --> 01:46:10,725
You know, there's different best stores.

01:46:11,399 --> 01:46:13,600
Churches, but here it's not, not that.

01:46:14,359 --> 01:46:22,819
But it is a thriving church community, nonetheless, and very decently interconnected and respectful of one another, if that makes sense.

01:46:24,180 --> 01:46:25,689
Um, politics.

01:46:26,619 --> 01:46:36,145
Oh, my blog post this month might be a March madness, uh, celebrating the Successful primaries of Joe Biden and Donald Trump.

01:46:37,885 --> 01:46:39,484
Who's your candidate in 2024?

01:46:39,555 --> 01:46:46,024
Um, it's Biden and, um, he's not my favorite, but he's a safe way to go.

01:46:46,145 --> 01:46:50,204
So I feel like that that's asking a lot these days.

01:46:50,204 --> 01:46:51,500
Uh, so I'm going to hold just kind of.

01:46:51,699 --> 01:46:59,779
Stay the course and, um, keep us in a good place, but he's no Obama, someone who's inspirational and more visionary.

01:47:00,029 --> 01:47:03,000
Um, but I will definitely take safe and steady over.

01:47:03,000 --> 01:47:12,899
What do you think it is about our system that would allow, uh, an obviously mentally declining person or two of them, perhaps, uh, to become the candidates?

01:47:12,909 --> 01:47:16,810
Like what's, what's wrong with the system that produces those outcomes?

01:47:17,239 --> 01:47:22,609
Cause I feel sorry for Biden, like, no offense intended, but.

01:47:23,465 --> 01:47:29,645
It's pretty obvious, like, he's, like, if he was your dad, you'd be thinking about putting him in a home.

01:47:29,854 --> 01:47:30,494
Mmm.

01:47:31,635 --> 01:47:32,034
No?

01:47:32,114 --> 01:47:35,765
My husband and I have talked about this, actually, at the dinner table.

01:47:35,765 --> 01:47:37,685
And I, I think it's a numbers game, right?

01:47:37,685 --> 01:47:40,694
If you're getting votes, you have to be, have been around a while.

01:47:41,145 --> 01:47:43,274
There's a lot of brand and name recognition.

01:47:43,274 --> 01:47:44,234
You know how it is with voting.

01:47:44,234 --> 01:47:44,324
Sure, sure.

01:47:44,324 --> 01:47:46,064
Like, it's just name recognition.

01:47:46,064 --> 01:47:47,505
Like, oh, I've heard of him or her.

01:47:47,505 --> 01:47:48,574
I'm just gonna check that.

01:47:48,954 --> 01:47:56,864
And then, also, there's, um, You're able to make coalitions and make deals with people who, right?

01:47:56,864 --> 01:48:02,234
And so you, you have to be, have been around a while to get to know those people and make those deals.

01:48:02,534 --> 01:48:05,095
And so I think that's a profession.

01:48:05,765 --> 01:48:07,215
Right, it has become one for sure.

01:48:07,216 --> 01:48:21,689
The longer you have been doing it, it's just easier for you to stay in power and, um, And you just have to, and sometimes right name recognition for good or bad is right good or bad publicity.

01:48:21,689 --> 01:48:22,460
It's a good thing.

01:48:22,810 --> 01:48:25,909
It's, um, and so people just recognize that.

01:48:25,930 --> 01:48:32,899
And yeah, I just think that it helps them because they've been in it for so long and they've been on TV.

01:48:32,909 --> 01:48:33,310
Right.

01:48:33,319 --> 01:48:34,890
I mean, like they have a long.

01:48:34,890 --> 01:48:36,800
So why do you think nobody challenged Biden?

01:48:38,149 --> 01:48:44,350
Because it seems like if they actually got up and debated and things, somebody else might have drawn the crowd's attention.

01:48:45,060 --> 01:48:47,920
I, you know, I've thought the same thing.

01:48:47,960 --> 01:48:58,420
Um, I've thought like, why isn't there some, like, someone who's made it big in tech who has money and can self fund their campaign who's younger.

01:48:58,795 --> 01:49:00,864
Why don't they run for office?

01:49:00,864 --> 01:49:02,345
Well, there was something keeping them from doing it.

01:49:02,824 --> 01:49:04,444
I think, in this session at least.

01:49:04,445 --> 01:49:06,444
I mean, it seems like it.

01:49:06,494 --> 01:49:10,015
The party is controlling the candidates too often, in my opinion.

01:49:10,295 --> 01:49:11,414
I'm a libertarian.

01:49:11,914 --> 01:49:13,765
So I voted for Kanye last election.

01:49:13,765 --> 01:49:15,204
I won't vote for Trump this time either.

01:49:15,585 --> 01:49:18,869
Is your, are you a sworn and true blue?

01:49:19,130 --> 01:49:21,689
Or do you have a strong distaste for Trump?

01:49:21,720 --> 01:49:22,899
It wouldn't matter.

01:49:23,270 --> 01:49:29,100
Like if there was a moderate, if Nikki Haley was the nominee instead of crazy orange hair guy, would you consider that?

01:49:29,119 --> 01:49:29,720
Or are you kind of.

01:49:29,750 --> 01:49:31,020
I would, yeah.

01:49:31,079 --> 01:49:31,470
Yeah.

01:49:31,529 --> 01:49:39,630
I would say, um, even though I'm a Democrat, like I'm open to more liberal, like candidates.

01:49:39,659 --> 01:49:52,515
So people who, um, are more inclusive, um, who, Um, still are fiscally, you know, responsible, but take care of different levels of society.

01:49:52,784 --> 01:49:52,814
Okay.

01:49:52,824 --> 01:49:55,045
Um, it's not just the haves.

01:49:55,045 --> 01:49:55,664
Take care of?

01:49:56,064 --> 01:49:56,305
Yeah.

01:49:56,305 --> 01:49:58,494
Like, I believe in a government support system.

01:49:58,505 --> 01:49:58,545
Okay.

01:49:58,854 --> 01:49:59,265
Right?

01:49:59,265 --> 01:50:02,114
I mean, I feel like I don't believe that, you know.

01:50:02,125 --> 01:50:03,385
The laissez faire is not gonna work for all.

01:50:03,385 --> 01:50:04,515
Yeah, exactly.

01:50:04,784 --> 01:50:04,814
Okay.

01:50:04,954 --> 01:50:06,175
But basically, um.

01:50:06,185 --> 01:50:12,564
Well, your, your life, though, is an example of people just willingly putting themselves out there, not the government telling them to.

01:50:12,595 --> 01:50:12,864
Mm hmm.

01:50:13,430 --> 01:50:13,510
That's true.

01:50:13,510 --> 01:50:15,979
And I think that people will do that more when the government does it.

01:50:15,980 --> 01:50:19,000
Um, I think it's both.

01:50:19,050 --> 01:50:19,880
I think you need both.

01:50:19,890 --> 01:50:27,039
See, I'm, I'm all about balance and I think, um, it's good to have both options because some people will never step up.

01:50:27,539 --> 01:50:27,850
Right.

01:50:27,970 --> 01:50:28,550
No, true.

01:50:28,590 --> 01:50:28,859
Yeah.

01:50:28,859 --> 01:50:30,670
And some people it doesn't matter.

01:50:30,720 --> 01:50:32,760
Um, it's their calling to do so.

01:50:33,060 --> 01:50:45,409
So yes, I've always questioned that about our system too, why there aren't, um, younger candidates, um, who obviously have great talent and experience who can bring a lot.

01:50:45,744 --> 01:50:47,265
To running our country.

01:50:47,284 --> 01:50:48,185
And right.

01:50:48,225 --> 01:50:51,704
I don't know the answer to that, but I would like to see more of them.

01:50:51,994 --> 01:50:56,824
But yes, even though I'm registered Democrat, um, I am open to other.

01:50:56,984 --> 01:50:58,145
What about the RFK?

01:50:58,175 --> 01:50:59,375
Have you investigated him at all?

01:50:59,564 --> 01:51:00,414
No, I haven't.

01:51:00,454 --> 01:51:03,444
Oh, I think I would just suggest you investigate RFK Jr.

01:51:03,444 --> 01:51:03,755
Okay.

01:51:03,805 --> 01:51:08,784
Um, you know, his Dad and his uncle were assassinated by our government, probably.

01:51:09,345 --> 01:51:10,734
They were both strong Democrats.

01:51:10,755 --> 01:51:15,364
He tried to run for the Democratic nomination, but was blackballed, basically, by the Democratic Party.

01:51:15,574 --> 01:51:15,914
Oh, really?

01:51:15,914 --> 01:51:17,404
Forced out to become an independent.

01:51:18,034 --> 01:51:19,524
But he's polling around 20%.

01:51:19,625 --> 01:51:20,154
Yeah.

01:51:20,395 --> 01:51:22,234
He's gonna be a difference maker in the election.

01:51:22,265 --> 01:51:22,734
Yeah.

01:51:23,125 --> 01:51:26,685
So, um But a lot of people just don't like to throw votes away in third party.

01:51:26,975 --> 01:51:30,694
They'd rather keep the, uh Uh, what is it?

01:51:30,704 --> 01:51:32,574
The dictatorship with two parties?

01:51:32,694 --> 01:51:33,744
The two party system.

01:51:33,895 --> 01:51:34,614
Two party dictatorship.

01:51:34,664 --> 01:51:36,045
it's, yes, outdated.

01:51:36,324 --> 01:51:38,875
Um, what are your thoughts on the Electoral College?

01:51:39,444 --> 01:51:40,725
Oh, I think it's important.

01:51:40,875 --> 01:51:46,234
If we didn't have the Electoral College, it would be ruinous to, uh, rural states.

01:51:46,234 --> 01:51:53,319
Like, uh, Oklahoma, North Dakota, because California and New York would just get to decide everything for everybody.

01:51:54,289 --> 01:51:59,649
So yeah, that, that, that electoral college needs to go because that's what got Trump elected.

01:52:00,220 --> 01:52:04,680
Like to me, Just to have a better candidate than fucking Hillary Clinton.

01:52:04,720 --> 01:52:05,279
I'm sorry.

01:52:05,390 --> 01:52:44,220
I really wanted somebody I would love to see a woman president and it needs to be somebody with more character than Hillary So I'm glad that she's not but no, I think the Electoral College is crucial at this point in time in my perception because a popular vote would it would go Democrat for from now on and Look at how the Democratic cities are going like they're all kind of cesspools and it wouldn't take that long I'm not saying I'm, I'm a Republican either, but it's, so the, the, the way I like to describe politics in a way is that, so there's like the conservative notion and then there's, there's chaos as well.

01:52:44,279 --> 01:52:46,930
And the progressives tend to be more chaos inducing.

01:52:46,930 --> 01:52:50,949
We're going to mix it up or, you know, and you need both.

01:52:51,420 --> 01:52:55,909
Like you need boundary stretching of this kind of more progressive thing.

01:52:55,911 --> 01:53:05,185
Like, you know, like, You know, for example, like, should gays be able to marry or at least have the civil benefits of a marital union?

01:53:05,930 --> 01:53:09,500
And as far as insurance and things like that, yes, to me, clearly.

01:53:10,770 --> 01:53:14,680
Did they have to call it a, uh, uh, you know, a wedding or a marriage?

01:53:15,130 --> 01:53:16,270
Maybe they could have called it something else.

01:53:16,300 --> 01:53:21,699
I don't, I'm not, I'm not there, but that, so I'm all for people having lots of rights and things.

01:53:22,680 --> 01:53:40,239
And if one side just dominates for a long time by importing a bunch of legals or things like that, or stacking the Supreme court, getting rid of the electoral college, then it's effectively loses that.

01:53:41,020 --> 01:53:45,920
Holding on to what has got us here and then you just invite chaos, period.

01:53:46,380 --> 01:53:49,229
Well, I know like the immigration situation in Denver.

01:53:49,500 --> 01:53:50,279
Oh, it's rough.

01:53:50,289 --> 01:53:50,729
Yeah.

01:53:51,329 --> 01:53:52,760
And it's only starting.

01:53:52,761 --> 01:53:55,242
Like it'll probably be twice as bad.

01:53:55,242 --> 01:53:59,670
Like if Biden gets reelected, it'll be four times as bad in three years.

01:54:00,829 --> 01:54:01,210
Period.

01:54:01,270 --> 01:54:02,300
I mean, the U.

01:54:02,300 --> 01:54:02,489
S.

01:54:02,500 --> 01:54:06,880
has, we're 330 million people against a world population of 8 billion.

01:54:07,600 --> 01:54:10,899
And about 7 billion of those 8 billion would rather be here.

01:54:12,840 --> 01:54:21,899
It's gonna be like even with 1 percent of the world's population decides to try to come here, it's gonna fuck our whole country up, like beyond infrastructure, because it couldn't happen.

01:54:22,529 --> 01:54:24,289
So I'm nervous about it.

01:54:24,670 --> 01:54:27,510
I'm cynical about all of them, uh, frankly.

01:54:27,970 --> 01:54:30,199
It's hard not to be cynical, I will say.

01:54:30,239 --> 01:54:30,750
For sure.

01:54:30,829 --> 01:54:31,170
Yeah.

01:54:31,289 --> 01:54:37,399
Um, let's talk about your loco experience, the craziest experience of your lifetime that you're willing to share with our listeners.

01:54:38,020 --> 01:54:42,119
Okay, so I have done a lot of like, adventurous things in my life.

01:54:42,159 --> 01:54:45,340
Like I said, some people would think they're crazy, but I don't think they're crazy.

01:54:45,340 --> 01:54:52,850
But I did do something in college that It's so against my normal judgment and nature.

01:54:52,880 --> 01:54:52,909
Okay.

01:54:53,409 --> 01:54:55,944
So I had Where this is going.

01:54:55,944 --> 01:55:02,729
I had some guy friends, and early in the week they're like, Hey Diana, we're going skydiving this weekend.

01:55:02,729 --> 01:55:03,609
You wanna come?

01:55:04,159 --> 01:55:06,500
And being that adventurous person, I'm like, Sure.

01:55:06,979 --> 01:55:13,020
But see, I had not researched, like, where this place was, what exactly we were doing.

01:55:13,029 --> 01:55:14,270
What's the thing that keeps me from dying?

01:55:14,270 --> 01:55:17,319
Yes! Like, have they had accidents?

01:55:17,319 --> 01:55:18,529
Like, what's their story?

01:55:19,520 --> 01:55:24,140
Like, all that stuff, you know, like, are they, um, certified even to begin with?

01:55:24,140 --> 01:55:24,670
I don't know.

01:55:24,670 --> 01:55:25,989
Maybe they just found some guy.

01:55:25,990 --> 01:55:27,329
Yeah, is this your buddy, Joe?

01:55:27,329 --> 01:55:27,750
Yeah.

01:55:27,750 --> 01:55:30,060
So I just was like, okay.

01:55:30,390 --> 01:55:35,329
And we get there and we're in this like three or four hour training.

01:55:36,180 --> 01:55:39,840
And I was like, you know, so there's two types of bungee jumping.

01:55:39,840 --> 01:55:45,409
There's tandem, where you just ride on like the back of someone and they, yeah, skydiving, sorry.

01:55:45,590 --> 01:55:51,279
And you free fall, and they do all the work, they do all the landing, yes.

01:55:51,479 --> 01:55:58,789
So we, they had signed up for the type where you have a rip cord, so you jump out of the plane on your own.

01:55:58,979 --> 01:56:01,850
And then the rip cord automatically pulls your chute for you.

01:56:01,850 --> 01:56:09,319
Once you get, It's got like a line that pulls it out of, but we were trained because one, you have to exit the plane safely, right?

01:56:09,319 --> 01:56:09,539
Right.

01:56:09,850 --> 01:56:12,270
You have to do like the special like move, right?

01:56:12,279 --> 01:56:22,409
So don't want to bump into the exactly and then you have to steer yourself to this This is Like, it's all on you.

01:56:22,659 --> 01:56:24,989
And they're like, you need to land in this field.

01:56:25,159 --> 01:56:26,670
And then there's like power lines.

01:56:26,670 --> 01:56:27,520
And I'm like, excuse me.

01:56:27,520 --> 01:56:32,449
You have to figure out with no training how to actually make yourself go north when the wind is a little bit southbound.

01:56:32,689 --> 01:56:34,109
Yeah, so they gave us some.

01:56:34,350 --> 01:56:42,319
Training tips, but this is only a three or four hour training and then I'm like, okay, they're like, okay Avoid the power lines at all costs.

01:56:42,319 --> 01:56:45,060
I'm like, um, what would happen if you had a power line?

01:56:45,090 --> 01:57:06,350
Oh, you'd probably die Oh my gosh Like this is not what I signed up for Like i'm literally like in charge of my life and I have to land in this field and avoid power lines because that's certain death And it was it was very scary And then just like doing the training I'm like, okay, you know, I never thought like, hey, you can just back out.

01:57:06,720 --> 01:57:07,170
I don't know.

01:57:07,170 --> 01:57:09,109
I guess that was never a thought.

01:57:09,109 --> 01:57:10,923
Somebody paid a bunch of money for this thing I guess.

01:57:10,923 --> 01:57:12,920
But I was like, I just gotta do this really well.

01:57:13,310 --> 01:57:14,329
Like, train well.

01:57:14,329 --> 01:57:16,095
And then they also had to train you.

01:57:16,095 --> 01:57:17,270
Take really good notes.

01:57:17,270 --> 01:57:21,010
They train you how to land because you don't want to break your knees.

01:57:21,011 --> 01:57:21,869
Right, right, right.

01:57:21,869 --> 01:57:22,810
You lock your legs out.

01:57:22,810 --> 01:57:28,404
Then you're like, okay, now I If I survive So it's like trying to take a golf swing.

01:57:28,414 --> 01:57:41,914
You're like, okay, just remember these 96 things about elbow straight, rotate the hip Yes! Freakin So if I don't die in a power line, I still gotta avoid breaking my legs, so you have to like, you know, roll a certain way.

01:57:42,125 --> 01:57:47,774
So, um, anyway, and they're, they're like describing the experience, and you're just like, taking it all in.

01:57:47,774 --> 01:57:49,055
It's like drinking from a fire hose.

01:57:49,055 --> 01:57:53,114
You're just like, okay, just stay alive, not break my knees.

01:57:53,444 --> 01:57:54,345
So, um.

01:57:54,979 --> 01:58:06,399
Anyway, so we get up in this tiny plane and there's like four of you, it was two friends, my best friend was there as moral support and Kevin was there as moral support.

01:58:06,400 --> 01:58:07,659
So they were just watching.

01:58:07,661 --> 01:58:12,029
Kevin's like, you're crazy, but he doesn't like heights.

01:58:12,029 --> 01:58:13,850
So he was like, I will watch you.

01:58:13,869 --> 01:58:15,340
I think he was kind of scared for me.

01:58:15,350 --> 01:58:17,579
He wanted to make sure I was okay, but there was nothing he could do.

01:58:17,779 --> 01:58:19,340
I had to make sure I was okay.

01:58:19,340 --> 01:58:21,010
Cause no one else was there to help.

01:58:21,289 --> 01:58:26,104
So, um, It was funny though, but my friends, they were scared to jump out of the plane.

01:58:26,114 --> 01:58:31,484
Like, it's a scary experience because you're like, right, everything is saying fear stop sign.

01:58:31,494 --> 01:58:32,234
Don't do it.

01:58:32,564 --> 01:58:41,125
Um, so like they go, I'm last because you have to like squeeze yourself in the plane and I could fit in the tail cargo in the back.

01:58:41,125 --> 01:58:49,585
So I'm last, um, I make my exit and, um, Which actually was perfect.

01:58:49,585 --> 01:58:58,765
It turned out, so if you had, I had a perfect exit, which means I could go up to the next level of training if I wanted to, but I did not want to one and done so Yeah.

01:58:58,765 --> 01:58:59,604
I was like, this is crazy.

01:58:59,609 --> 01:59:00,984
I'm doing, I could do tandem.

01:59:01,135 --> 01:59:02,515
I will never do that again.

01:59:02,784 --> 01:59:06,590
So I, it's not, I'm not like you could take, somebody else would be, oh, you would go with somebody Tand.

01:59:06,630 --> 01:59:07,255
I would with someone else.

01:59:07,260 --> 01:59:07,470
Yeah.

01:59:07,470 --> 01:59:07,670
Yeah, yeah.

01:59:07,670 --> 01:59:07,829
Fair.

01:59:07,835 --> 01:59:08,154
Yeah.

01:59:08,305 --> 01:59:16,045
So then you know the, I am floating with my parachute and it's Oklahoma, and when you don't have anything on the horizon.

01:59:17,100 --> 01:59:17,590
Right.

01:59:17,590 --> 01:59:19,039
You can't tell you're falling.

01:59:19,041 --> 01:59:20,000
Where exactly am I going?

01:59:20,000 --> 01:59:21,239
You can't tell you're falling.

01:59:21,239 --> 01:59:21,979
It's boring.

01:59:22,039 --> 01:59:22,520
Oh, right.

01:59:22,560 --> 01:59:29,149
I'm free falling, but I can't tell, and I'm like, la la la, this is not the adventure adrenaline rush I was expecting.

01:59:29,890 --> 01:59:30,619
It was.

01:59:30,960 --> 01:59:32,489
But the exciting part was like.

01:59:32,810 --> 01:59:33,380
Exciting.

01:59:33,380 --> 01:59:35,420
But the part that was like, okay, I gotta pay attention.

01:59:35,460 --> 01:59:36,680
I gotta land in that field.

01:59:36,920 --> 01:59:40,850
Well, I ended up landing in the field next to it.

01:59:40,859 --> 01:59:42,729
So I didn't hit my mark.

01:59:43,060 --> 01:59:48,210
Um, and then, so it's boring, boring, boring until the last, I don't know, 50 feet or something.

01:59:48,210 --> 01:59:50,350
And then you see the ground rising to meet you.

01:59:50,350 --> 01:59:51,346
Rushing up at you very quickly.

01:59:51,346 --> 01:59:52,060
Yes, very quickly.

01:59:52,060 --> 01:59:53,795
And then you're like, I got a roll.

01:59:53,854 --> 02:00:07,314
So I kind of did the roll and it was in an ant pile and I'm like getting bitten, but I didn't break my legs and I will never do that again where I'm jumping out of the plane myself for skydiving.

02:00:07,324 --> 02:00:08,814
You kind of made me want to skydive.

02:00:09,635 --> 02:00:10,984
Like, I've never really wanted to.

02:00:11,175 --> 02:00:14,895
It seems freaky, but you explaining it in so much detail makes me kind of want to try it.

02:00:14,904 --> 02:00:17,765
Oh my gosh, like I said, it went against all my likes.

02:00:17,774 --> 02:00:22,585
See, I'm adventurous, but I try to take, like, You have a strong sense of self preservation.

02:00:22,625 --> 02:00:28,595
Exactly, and I want to do it in a safe way, you know, and Girl Scouts is saying safety first.

02:00:29,345 --> 02:00:35,729
And so, um, I didn't, yeah, it was kind of like the place was kind of just like this warehouse in the middle of nowhere.

02:00:35,920 --> 02:00:37,569
I really don't think it was a safe place.

02:00:37,930 --> 02:00:39,449
Like, they might not have had insurance.

02:00:39,449 --> 02:00:40,880
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

02:00:41,449 --> 02:00:42,649
I think they weren't.

02:00:42,819 --> 02:00:45,810
And um, so that was my loco experience.

02:00:46,270 --> 02:00:46,649
I like it.

02:00:46,819 --> 02:00:47,569
And I survived.

02:00:47,569 --> 02:00:48,109
Thank goodness.

02:00:48,119 --> 02:00:48,340
Good job.

02:00:48,340 --> 02:00:49,020
To tell the tale.

02:00:49,420 --> 02:00:50,149
I'm glad you're here.

02:00:50,689 --> 02:00:58,850
Um, if somebody wants to buy a copy of Let Go of the Rope or to reach out to you, what's your best, uh, contact points?

02:00:58,909 --> 02:01:03,489
Okay, so my, uh, the book's available on Amazon as an e book or a print.

02:01:03,720 --> 02:01:04,770
So that's easy.

02:01:04,909 --> 02:01:10,145
Um, and then, uh, My website is love to appreciate consulting and they can reach out to me there.

02:01:10,145 --> 02:01:11,074
Love with a TO.

02:01:11,079 --> 02:01:11,430
Appreciate.

02:01:11,489 --> 02:01:11,710
Yes.

02:01:11,739 --> 02:01:12,029
Okay.

02:01:12,064 --> 02:01:14,494
Love to, yeah, appreciation.

02:01:14,795 --> 02:01:16,324
Love to appreciate.com.

02:01:16,444 --> 02:01:16,534
Okay.

02:01:16,534 --> 02:01:17,585
Sorry, did I say consulting?

02:01:17,590 --> 02:01:17,885
Yes.

02:01:18,154 --> 02:01:29,314
Um, so love to appreciate.com and they can, yeah, my contact info's there, so if they're interested in culture design or leadership training or coaching, they can find me there.

02:01:29,404 --> 02:01:29,704
Awesome.

02:01:30,335 --> 02:01:30,994
Well thanks for being here.

02:01:30,994 --> 02:01:31,564
I hope you had fun.

02:01:31,625 --> 02:01:32,524
Yeah, thanks for interviewing.

02:01:32,524 --> 02:01:32,765
All right.

02:01:32,765 --> 02:01:33,210
See you next time.