EXPERIENCE 154 | Leveling Up and Building Teams with Ian Simkiss - Executive Vice President of Centennial Management, Inc.

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I was introduced to Ian Simkus at a very interesting time in his career journey, as the soon to be announced and newly appointed Executive Vice President of Centennial Management Inc., overseeing Centennial Leasing and Sales location in Windsor and Englewood in Colorado and in Phoenix, Arizona. They also offer fleet leasing and sales operations nationwide and a relationship buying service to AAA members in Colorado. All in all, Ian now oversees over 70 independent sales consultants, finding cars, trucks, SUVs, fleet vehicles, classic cars, and more. He represents the foundation for the second generation of leadership for this 40 plus year enterprise. Previous to this new role, Ian had served as the general manager of Centennial Leasing and Sales in Northern Colorado for nine years. And in six years as an independent consultant, they didn't have a manager for those first six years. And when they were threatened with a manager to help improve a low performing group, Ian's wife and his work associates told him it should be you. It's clear in talking with Ian that he's a different kind of car guy focused on the culture of his team, the experience of their clients, and the integrity of the process. Ian was raised in Chapita park in the Colorado Springs region and attended Manitou Springs high school. He's been a standout baseball player. A college dropout, a restaurant worker, and a professional hip hop DJ along the journey. I've come to know him as an excellent community connector, a strong advocate for vocational education, and for integrity in business. It's not a stretch to say we've become fast friends since our initial introduction, and I'm pleased to share with you my conversation with Ian Simkus. Welcome back to the Loco Experience Podcast. I'm honored today to be joined by Ian Oh shit, I forgot your last name. Simkus. Simkus. Ian Simkus. Yeah. Uh, welcome to the show. Thank you. Very excited to be here. Ian is the, uh, newly anointed executive vice president for centennial management. Inc. Correct. Uh, which is a pretty broad, uh, services auto business that I'll let you describe. Why don't you describe it? Well, so, uh, the company's been in business since 1984. Uh, started as a fleet management company, managing, uh, you know, commercial units for, for companies. Um, after a couple of years of what we did, people came to the company and said, well, I really like what you did for the, for our company. Uh, can you help my wife or my spouse or whatever? And we said, sure. And so in 1987, we became a full fledged car dealership and have grown since then to Arizona in 89 and then in, in Northern Colorado here, uh, we opened the doors in 93. Okay. So, uh, Denver? Yeah. And Lakewood on the left side. Yeah. Yeah. And then, uh, now it's the, the, the call it the corporate office and the big sister is, is in Englewood. Um, and then, uh, we just moved into a building across the street from mash lab on crossroads and it's, it's a great building. Um, we, we built that building and moved in and. in November of 21, um, after 27 years in what we like to call mom's basement. After what we saw, we were in a, in the basement of the office building over on College and Harmony across the street from the Ford store. So that, so you didn't actually have like a lot in inventory and stuff at that time. We had, we did have, we did have inventory and we did have, uh, I made a sweetheart of a deal with Sava. So there's a, there's a joke I've never quite fleshed out, but we, we donated a bunch of money to them to do with what they please so that I could park my cars in their backyard and I, you know, I'd never quite fleshed that joke out, but it was there. Yeah. You know, so if you make a joke around, well, you gotta be careful for sure. Yeah. You gotta be careful for sure. But, uh, yeah, so we, you know, we had, we had about 20, 25 cars in stock at any given time there, but you're mostly. Finders like what you have an inventory. Yeah. Your whole game. No. In fact, that's one of my favorite things is we're, we're very resourceful. Um, we do any, make any model new use does not matter. Um, and it really truly is about the client experience. So, uh, if there's programs out on a new car, we can go get them. Um, if, you know, if there's leases, um, incentives, any kind of rebates. Even though you're not a new car dealer, you have a relationship, reasonably friendly relationship with new car dealers. Literally the only cars that we can't get are the, uh, the Teslas and the Rivians right now. Okay. You know, if you really wanted a Maserati, we can, we can solve that problem. And you can save me money over going to the Maserati dealer or why would I have you as the middleman or just because I can't find the car I'm really looking for? Those are excellent questions. Um, both and, and really truly the question that we kind of cater to is what's your time worth? You know, you can, you can spend an entire Saturday or an entire month of Saturdays going to every dealership and, and. I'm feeling all the cars out and testing and going through test drives and, and, and trying to pick out the best liar, if you will, uh, where we, we aren't biased by any means by any manufacturer. We, we, uh, there's been days and you know, the, the days are coming again where I would have say a Nissan Altima and a Honda Accord, a Toyota Camry and a Volkswagen Passat lined up for my client to drive. And then I can say, well, this one leases like this. This one's got this incentive. It's your money, spend it wisely. And so it's, it's really not about your best deal, you know, our, our tagline, and we really truly live it and, and make all our decisions on it as your best automotive buying experience. And so based on that. You know, what is your time worth? And you could spend all day doing that, or you could buy a car in 30 minutes after a few discovery phone calls and go back to your life and do whatever it is that you do. Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty great. So is that, so you've got some Phoenix area operation, Englewood and then Northern Colorado and is. So those are the three Centennial Leasing and Sales brands. Um, we also have, uh, our own independent lease company. Uh, ILC is what they're called. It's called Centennial Leasing, Inc. Um, and that is, we do a ton of commercial business there. Where we do, you know, open end type of track leases for companies to keep them in business. With or without Actually supplying them with a vehicle? No, we still, we still go get the car and, and, and, and lease the car. We, we guarantee the residuals and it's our, it's our deal. Oh, wow. Um, so similar and, and much smaller in scale to like an Enterprise or a wheels type of brand, um, but we're able, we're able to, to. You know, I will say when you really get the math down, uh, we're able to, to compete very competitively with, with those big brands. We have, uh, Like they would use it for bigger trucks and everything? Yeah, absolutely. Um, I'm trying, I was just trying to pull the number. I, I'm going to round it and say with, uh, the Center for Environmental Military Land Cleanup, um, for CSU. It's a specific department. We've got roughly, uh, 180 units that, that we lease to them. And they're, they're all over the country. In fact, we've got, I think it's six, but Jim will, my consultant, Jim Ambrose, will tell me for sure that I was wrong. Um, but I think we've got six. Trucks on the island of Guam that we'll never see we bought them from the dealership there leased them to Semmel They'll buy it out and we'll just return it right back to the dealership. Yeah. Oh, okay Yeah, so you're kind of a financing structure for all kinds of people for commercial mostly Yeah, you know, we we have aught in type of creative deals that we do for consumers But it's it's got to really make sense has the the changing cost of money world. No, it's a lot for you It's, it's terrifying, especially in that, you know, it's, it's, uh, money's not free, and, uh, it, it's hard, it, it, it's hard. It, it, really the bigger, the bigger thing that's been, you know, maybe not so much, and, and maybe it is in the people's eye, but, is, is the dynamic, um, changing market. The value at the end. Yeah, well. Yeah. Just the last three years through COVID and product supply and demand and problems. Yeah. It was worth a lot for a while. Yeah. Which, which makes it really hard to justify what's this car going to be worth at least. And in three years when we can't tell you what it's worth right now. So it's, it's really been an interesting game for the last couple of years. Yeah. Yeah. Um, How many people work at, like, this whole operation? Uh, so in Phoenix we've got 15 consultants. Um, in Englewood there's about 45. It's a pretty big, pretty big group. And we've got 15 here. And then one, one, the other entity that we didn't We didn't cover is, is, uh, AAA. We're, we're actually partners with AAA here in Colorado. So if you were to walk into a AAA office and say, Hey, I want to use your buying services, that's us too. Oh, okay. Interesting. Um, I didn't realize that was a service that AAA offered. Well, you're clearly not a AAA. I am a AAA member, but I just use it for the free towing on my old shit. Yeah, exactly. So it's, uh, so those are, those are the five entities under the corporate banner. Um, and so you have oversight over all of those or you're in the sales. I'm just, so, so there's three of us that are, that are taking these EVP roles at the corporate suite. Um, I've, we've got a, a system, a VP of systems and as VP of operations. So, you know, in, in broad strokes, the operations guide as the HR and the accounting and the systems guide as all the it and all the back and stuff. And then all the revenue generation and commission stuff, things like that. It's all on you. Yeah. Here we go. Yeah. It's exciting. It's daunting. There's a lot. Yeah. And there's mostly it's 10 99 dudes, right? So, it kind of depends on the operation, but here in Colorado, all of our consultants are 1099. Okay. Yeah, um, and, and it's kind of a, that's, that's open for discussion at this point in other places. Um, the AAA guys are, are employees, so it's a little, little different. Yeah. A little different breed of animal. Well, cause AAA has, you know, they've purchased a service. Right. They're going to have high quality control over that, I imagine, or whatever. Right. And you know, what's interesting, you know, when you get into the branding and, and, and this is why these are great opportunities for us to talk about this. So thanks again for having me. Sure. But, you know, AAA is a household brand. Every, everyone knows that name. Where, you know, that's something that. Over the years and especially as the, as the marketing systems have kind of diluted over the last 20, 25 years, you know, we used to be able to run an ad and this is well before my time, but I just know the history. Cause it's, that's my problem to know, but you know, in the, in the nineties, uh, our Inglewood operation, the, the consultants banded together and did, uh, eight, eight 50 KOA ads on the money talk show. Okay. But it was really easy to see. I would say that that ad ran at 830 and the phone rang at 845. Sourcing was pretty simple, you know, so now you get into the, the broader, the, the broader version of it's really hard to define where and how those clients come from. And so it's really, it's a, it's a really interesting thing that That we do versus the store, you know, the traditional franchise dealership, they spend a lot of money. Yeah, I was gonna say, like, what's your responsibility to try to drive business to these 15 consultants in Northern Colorado, for example? You know, uh, according to our, according to our Independent contract agreement and really kind of the model that we've said it's, it's very much, um, like Jake from State Farm. It's real, that's like the best example I can give, you know, no one calls on Monday morning after the Super Bowl and goes, man, I got to get me some of that State Farm insurance. Even though Jake was there, um, what that, what does happen is it's front of mind is a state farm and then you see a billboard or a bus stop or something along those lines and that's always a local agent. And so that's really the way that we attack. Okay. Um, and the other thing that we do a ton of is, is, um, You know, chamber, chamber of commerce, um, we're, we're active in all Loveland, Windsor, Greeley, Fort Collins chambers. Um, just about every consultant is in a B and I or a master networks or a one BC or something of that nature. And that's like a reimbursable expense. So you're like encouraging them to get out of the, well, we do much better on the one to one, you know, and, and, and the question really is what is your, you know, when you look at the. The, the demographic, if you will, of, of Northern Colorado, uh, would you probably say it's fair from Longmont to, to Cheyenne just to be fair and then, you know, call it Estes to East Greeley in that, in that oval, because it's definitely not a circle. Um, there's probably a million people, give or take, and, and, and in that, you know, we're not, we're not trying to shotgun approach our, our marketing. We, we very much look at. That one to one connection, there's always going to be a niche for that. There's always going to be a market for that. And there's always going to be the person that's just truly looking for a seamless, trustworthy experience as opposed to option A. Just a different buying experience. You know, if, if I'm, if I'm selling Audis and Porsches, then of course you need an Audi or a Porsche if you come to my dealership and same thing at the V& W shop or the whatever, right. And that's where we kind of. It's, it's real, again, it's really nice. I'm not tied to one brand. Uh, the consultants can kind of do whatever they please. And we've got, you know, we've got, uh, we've got, um, consultants that have in their career have been at a Ford store where all they could sell was Ford. And then they come to us and like, Oh my gosh, I can sell anything. And, uh, you know, at some point we all go through life changes, whether, whether it's, it's our own personality or it's our own need or whatever that might be. And maybe I don't need an F 150 anymore. Maybe I hit the lottery and I want to drive that Maserati. Yeah. I, I, I have one stop to, to go to, uh, with a seamless experience and it's, it's very, it's very nice. So you have a lot of long time customers probably. So it's a little bit like, in some ways it's like building a restaurant where your new customers come and hopefully stay and your long time customers keep staying. It's funny that you say that cause that's, I, you know, I, I had a job a long time, it feels like a million years ago. I was a bartender and I learned it early that if you took care of people, they just kept coming back. Right. And, uh, you know, there'd be Friday nights when I wasn't working, going to a concert or something. And we, you know, everybody in the bar was like, Why aren't you working tonight? Cause we stopped by for a drink or whatever on the way. So I learned early that those people not, not only are they loyal and they will always come back to see you, but they tip really well. And it's not really about the, it's not really about the price. They really understand the service and what they're getting out of it. Well, and trust is worth trusting that I didn't get screwed is worse. Worth more than thinking you got a really good deal on a car. That's, that's why I said, what's your time worth and what's the whole experience worth? You know, the, the, I guess I would ask you, I throw it back since we're, we're open dial. What, like, what do you expect when you go to buy a car? Um Yeah, that's a good question. I haven't bought like a new car in a long time. I usually buy used cars off of Craigslist cause I feel like I'm pretty good at qualifying the right unit for me and stuff. Um, but yes, when I've interacted with, with cars and dealers and stuff, I I don't expect to get sold the, you know, the next higher priced car compared to the one I can afford. Sure. You know, so, somebody trying to stretch my budget. Or, or, or something's got a flat on it, or something's old age, or whatever that looks like, they're trying to get out of that and move the unit and not really build a relationship. Yeah, for sure. Um, you know, that, that's, the, the You're the fastest Um, highest profit margin transaction that that person can. Exactly. Yeah. And, and there's six or seven people involved to make that, that as profitable as an experience for the store. Right. As opposed to the consumer, you know, and that's where our consultants go literally A to Z. They, you know, I'm, I, there's no, there's no man behind the curtain and there's no game of that, you know, really, truly. It's more like meet a car expert. Yeah. Explore together. And it almost, it almost boils down to, it's more, you know, and I can't, I gotta be careful with it. It's, it's more like an, uh, a financial advisor on how you're going to spend your money on this very expensive purchase. Um, a lot of people don't know how the math works. Um, and that's one of the things that, you know, when we, when we sit down with a client, we'll literally turn the screen and say, here's how. All of this works. Here's, here's your lease options. Here's what buying it looks like. Do you guys lease a large percentage of your units or across the board? Yes. Um, you know, we, we don't need to go into why because you do so much of the commercial space and different things like that. Well, that in that intentionally. There's definitely, there's definitely an understanding with, with our clientele. You know, we don't do a lot of subprime, like lower credit stuff, we just don't see it. Um, and it's, and it's mostly because the way that, the way that we've catered our business model is really to the busy professional, if you will, but. Um, we do, you know, across the board, it's about, it's about 50%, um, you know, our Inglewood operation does, does better than that. And our Phoenix location does worse than that. Um, here, you know, we're, we're, we're about 70, 30, um, finance to, to lease, uh, in, in Northern Colorado. Um, I, I can attribute that to, um, You know, I, I started with the company in 2009 as a consultant, um, and I, I took the role as GM in 2015, uh, and, and we really never, ever focused on how do you, Take care of the client as well as you can. Uh, meaning the company values were always there, but, but there was no coaching and there was no training. There was no, like, here's another way to do this, to help your clients. It was like qualified by the values, but not really equipped by the leadership. Exactly. Well, we had none, which is crazy. When I started with a company that, uh, in, in, in, or in Fort Collins, there was six consultants. Um, and, and none were hired until I took over the role as gm. Um, it was just kind of the wild, wild west of the north is what I called it. And, uh, literally there was, there was no, there was no directional leadership. There was no one steering the ship. It was just everybody out there doing whatever they wanted. Yeah. Trying to sling iron. Yeah. And, and you know, I. I can say that my, my vision has evolved since I've been with the company, but you know, when I, uh, I, on a short story, we were kind of threatened with the manager because there was a series of small fires that no one could put out except ownership. Right, right. And, and they, at the time they were building our building down in, in Inglewood. And so, you know, we've had one of those kind of ass kicking, um, boiler room type of meetings, you know. kind of conversation. You know, and I, I learned a long time ago that there's, there's times when, you know, you might be get yelled at in a group setting, but it might not be aimed at you, but you just sit there and you take it. But uh, I walked away from that meeting going, well, I had a pretty good year this year. And, and I went home to my wife and said, you know, I, I don't, I think I gotta go somewhere else. And she said, well, what do you mean? I said, well, they're going to hire some jerk to come in and, and ruin everything, you know, living my best life. I, at the time, I had just my, my son and I was kind of working from home, uh, running a pretty, you know, pretty specific business model that I had created. And um, you know, she's, her immediate reaction was, you should take the job. And I, nope, I'm not doing that. And I went into I came in here to get away from having a lot of responsibilities. Yeah, you know, and so I went in the next day to the, uh, to the business manager who retired in 2020 after 31 years with the company. And, and I asked her, you know, Hey, what'd you think yesterday's meeting? And her answer was, well, you should take the job. And I was like, God dang it. My, my housewife and my work wife, you know, they, they're both telling me I should take it. And so that was like November of 2014. And I hemmed and hawed for. A couple of months, um, it was probably February before I said, okay, I'll throw my name in the hat. Yeah. But, but again, my vision is kind of, my vision of where we're going and what's possible has changed. It's definitely, it's definitely gotten bigger, but we've accomplished all the things that we attempted to accomplish. And so, you know, One of the things that we didn't do a very good job of was branding. We, we weren't out in the public, you know, it was literally just how low under the radar can I fly and get by was the mentality of the consultants. Um, where, you know, now I've got three of my guys here in Windsor of the, call it 80 to a hundred, give or take, I don't know the exact number of consultants within the organization. Um, three of them are in the top 10 consistently now. Nice. Um, which is. something, because there's a couple of heavy hitters in that group. I mean, we, we move a lot of, we move a lot of cars. There's a lot of people that understand what we do. So I was just thinking about some similarities in that, you know, when you get, when you move into this general manager position, if you've got all these kind of wild, wild west yahoos that. They haven't had any real oversight or direction, um, with, with local think tank, our facilitators are contractors as well, right? Typically semi retired or retired CEOs and stuff. And they're wealthy already. They don't need my money. So they're more like volunteers, right? You know? And so if I try to squeeze them and make them dance, they'll be like, well, piss off. Well, and you know, you know what it is. I, I've, I've, I've gotten analogy that I've created and it, and it really. It resonates really strong, um, you know, my role as the, as the manager of the organizer of, of this flow that we want to happen, I'm very much a cattle dog. You know, I've got the cattle and I, and they're roaming all over the field and I need them to go in a specific direction. And so, you know, making sure that your policies are, are, are stout and, and the people that enforce those policies and communicate it, but the people that enforce it. So you really look at. The policies being the panels of the fence and then the, you know, your staff being the posts, the stronger those policies are, the easier it is for me to run those cattle up that fence the way I want them to go. And that's really the way that I've attacked it. And I can tell you, um, I won't name any names, but I, I fought tooth and nail with a couple of them as, as it, it wasn't so much about relinquishing control as it was like. Changing their perspective on what could be, you know, very much under the radar. So holy cow, looking at how much money I could make exploring the win, win, right? Like, Hey, if we do it this way, you'll actually win too. And, and, and, and I, you know, I'm, I'm a stats guy, so I can throw it all in a spreadsheet and I can prove. That if the, you know, the guys that the guys that pay attention, the guys that pay attention, I can prove on a stat, you know, on a graph, that's just, you know, up, up, up and, and plateauing out at unbelievable numbers for these guys. Um, selling cars that I can go remember when you fought me, remember all that. Trust me on this one, you know? And so eventually it works, but yeah. What do you think are the best, uh, the top characteristics, maybe two or three characteristics of the. Best people in the, in your industry. Um, the best people in our industry are ones that, that truly care about the client. Um, you know, it's not, it's not about the sale. You know, one of the things that we, we can, we can brag about at least in Colorado, um, is we run a over 60 percent repeat referral business. So if you take care of those clients and you do the right thing. You don't put them in, in bad loans, don't put them in bad cars. They come back. It's amazing. Um, so, so truly true, true customer service is, is that, um, you know, I'm going to say something that you you'll know, uh, is, is being able to manage your time very well, um, and, and, and, and being a professional, I think those fit to the same, um, You know, I always, I always laugh at the, at the guys that, that will, you know, get a call at eight o'clock on a, on a Thursday night and, and drop everything to go help that client. And I always, I always say, well, would, would your doctor do the same? I, no one's going to die tonight if they don't buy a car, you know, you can tell them, Hey, I'll work on that tomorrow and I'll call you by 11, yeah, whatever that looks like. Like, and the guys that, that, that truly adopt that mentality do very well. Um, and then you just gotta, you gotta be a student of, of life, of business, of people, and the, and the guys that really pay attention to that really excel. Really excel. Yeah. How much, uh, like. Six figures is a pretty approachable income for, you know, yes, absolutely. Uh, I've got a couple of guys, I got a couple of guys over it, not, not in the sevens, but, but, you know, in the two, three, you know, squiggly lines at the beginning, you know, like that. Uh, they do. I mean, they pay a lot of taxes. They do. Uh, they do, but they, man, they, they earn it and, and, and they, they, they see it. And uh, you know, it, it's not, I, I've had to come to terms with it over the last year or so. Um, cause we've grown a lot, you know, when we moved into the building, we had eight consultants and now we have. 15. Um, and, and, and what I've, what I've come to terms with is, is it's not my way. It's the centennial way. Yeah. And once somebody buys into that and commits to that, it's like, man, this is super easy. This is the best job that is. I can make. Six figures and all selling cars, which is unbelievable, right? Um, without being an upper manager at a store, uh, we, we really value the work life balance, you know, have your own hours. If you want to go to your kid's soccer game, whatever, you know, when I, when I, when my son was born and he's 11 now. When my son was born, I, you know, I called my mentor and good friend that was one of the owners and said, Hey, great news. You know, I'm going to be a dad. And he said, you know, I was kind of feeling them out to see how it would go because I know how it would go in a dealership and like, well, that sucks. You're going to have to work more. And his immediate reaction was. Well, that's awesome, because now you're going to be at PTA meetings and soccer meetings and all kinds of places where you can be in the community and networking and getting to know other parents. And we spend less money in marketing, so we don't, you know, it's like, I didn't expect that response, but, but he's exactly right. You know, we, we really value that work life balance. It's, it's very important, um, that everyone, every, every, you said it, but it's, it's a philosophy of the company is win, win, win. Yeah. Cool. Cool. Cool. Yeah. Um, Talk to me about, uh, the industry, like we were talking before we started recording, even about how, and even since we started, like the values going up and down and different things, like what's the state of the industry now? Well, uh, today in 2024, um, with it being an election year and you're already seeing the Fed talking about lowering the reserve, um, rates are starting to drop. But one of the things that, that I think, I think two things have happened over the last couple of years. At the beginning it was, you know, there was panic at the beginning of COVID. Um, but it didn't last very long. Um, honestly, we were, we were, uh, what do they call it? Um, when you were, um, necessary. Essential. Essential. We were non essential for one single day in the state of Colorado. Okay. Uh, I think that, you know, I spent that whole day cleaning my garage and on the phone, you know, trying to decide what we're going to do as a company and, and talking with ownership and other managers and trying to figure out a game plan. And I think the powers that be realize that you got to sell a lot of breakfast burritos to make up for the tax income of a, you know, one single 50, 000 car. And so they went, okay, well you can't, you can't. Be in the store. You got to do home deliveries, which is something that we've been doing since day one, like it was, there was no, there was no pivot. There was no change. There was no strategy. It was like, well, we're just going to go back to work. And so, you know, the demand, the demand, um, that you got to think about the car, cars weren't built for about 90 days. Um, you know, call it March to June, uh, March to March to May, um, because. All the manufacturers stopped to do, you know, they were doing the, um, the, uh, sanitizer at Chevy and they were doing Well, yeah, they shut down the Corvette line to build frickin word I was, that's the word I was trying to pull out. Um, so they stopped making cars for about 90 days. And so what happened was, because we, 2020 was an all time record year of new cars sales. It was almost, it was 17. 7 million new cars were sold in 2020 and 2019 and 2020 wasn't too far. I don't remember the exact number. I just remember 2020 cause we just talked about it. Um, but. You know, there's, there was a 90 day lull in, in, in, uh, production, but the demand never really stopped, uh, the manufacturers and the, and we call them the captives. Those are, you know, say Ford motor credit or Toyota motor credit or Subaru finance. They, they started running gimmicky 84 months, 0 percent type of things just to stay in business. Right. Right. Um, which, you know, one, one of the things that was dumb. If anybody wants to sit and talk with me about why that doesn't work, I'd be happy to do that another time, but, um, so what, what then happened is those, um, Those vehicles, uh, kind of stockpiled a little bit or, or, or diminished, excuse me, at the, at the same time, the used car market kind of, kind of dropped because there just was no cars. So when, you know, basic supply and demand, there's no cars. So what's out there, especially the nice stuff went up in value, which we've never seen before. Uh, you know, even through 08 through 2011, we've never seen an appreciation. Um, and, and then, uh, you know, that, that kind of lulled out with, uh, with, uh, Hertz filing bankruptcy in the late summer of 2020, uh, and it was real, just a reorganization of that. But then that took us into, you know, the fall and winter of 2020 and then. Starting then you, everyone started hearing about ship chip shortages, whether you're buying a, a microwave or a car or a cell phone, it's like, well, you can't cause they can't make the chips. And so, uh, a lot of people don't know, but there's, there's like hundreds of micro chip processors in a car. Sure. I mean, every power mirror, every power, everything, and there's, you know, it's a rolling computer. And so the like production just basically stopped and every manufacturer, no manufacturer could get them. And so going from. You know, call it February or so of 21 through the, I'd say July or so of, of 2022. I mean, it was a long haul where, you know, they couldn't build cars fast enough because they couldn't get the parts, you know, people would order something that would normally take. three months to show up and it was a used car market still firm because of that at the same time because you can't get a new car. Anything that's out there is going up in value up, up, up, up, up. And so, you know, as that happened, then, um, you know, it started to get a little bit of, of, of ease of pressure going into the, the 23 model year, but not, not a ton really. We started seeing it. Does. This last summer we started seeing products starting to come out, but where I started this whole tangent was price fatigue. I think at first people just didn't really care. I really want that whatever it is, you know, I want that Chevy Tahoe, plus I had a bunch of fresh juice from Uncle Joe and stuff from the, you know, you know, whatever, willing, willing to pay, you know, 15 grand over for a Tahoe because it, it exists. Right. Um. And, and rates were still low. And so as we jacked the interest rates over the last 18 months, and we've got these over inflated prices, I really think people just slowed down, which is what it was designed to do. I, now, my opinion, I'm not an economist or an interest person, but we could have done it a little different route and maybe not created it. So it was kind of painful in 23 in some ways? 23 was a tough year, but we still had a record year, which is quite interesting. So you're capturing market share. Yeah. Yeah, well, I would think so. Yeah, and I think part of that is people really want, they just want to be told the truth. It's mind blowing that, you know, someone would, someone would want to spend 50 to 100 grand on a car and not be lied to. Um, so, so as it sits now, based on that history, um, rates are coming down, new car inventory starting to sit, which is, you know, instead of over, over MSRT, MSRP type prices, now we're seeing reducted, reduced prices to us, which the rental companies are selling their Tesla fleets and stuff. Well, that, I saw that last week. Uh, I don't know that that's a thing, to be honest. Um, you know, they, that's a whole nother, I mean, I'm happy to talk about it, but I, I, I think electric cars are really cool. They're not the solution. Yeah. They're just not. Well, the system can't handle it. The, well, the infrastructure can't and, and, you know, the, I always like to call it Disneyland. You're like the United States has this, has this intent on looking to the world like Disneyland. You ever been to Disneyland? Yeah. You know, I, I've been to Anaheim too and it's, it's not that nice, you know, inside the park. It's beautiful outside the park. It's not that nice. Um, and so. And Fresno, less so still. Yeah. You know, it's, it's, you know, it's so, so I think the, the, the optics to the world are, Hey, let's be the cleanest, nicest, freshest air place. Uh, we still have our trash cans, you know, San Francisco, Chicago, whatever that is, uh, even Denver at this point. Um, but, but at the, you know, to the world, Hey, we're the cleanest thing there is, you know, no one, no one really. Look how hard we're trying. Yeah, exactly. And, and, but no one wants to talk about where's the energy come from. Right. No one wants to talk about what it, what it costs to extract the minerals that are needed to create the batteries. Well, and even just the challenge of human behavior. Yes. People get home, want to plug their electric car in to charge it up on the And you get a whole brownout from a whole day. Yeah, because everybody's got their air conditioners on too and whatever. Right. There's no, and the sun just went down. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, uh, you know, that was one of the things when we built the building, um, we, we had a, a, a good long conversation in the design phase of, should we put in, you know, stage three chargers, um, and, and the, our building is ready for it, but I, I can't, I can't. So it's not a product that you really turn too much of. No, we don't sell a lot of it, but, but. Honestly, nobody else really is either. So, I mean, Tesla's doing fine, but, but you know, it, you know, when we get a, our, our, whether it's a Kia or a Hyundai or a Jeep guy that's calling to say, Hey, you, you want to, you know, stock some of this inventory and help us sell it. They're not selling it. You know, they're not sending us stuff that we were going to sell it, stuff that's sitting on their lot and no one's buying, you know? So it's, it's, it's a big, it's a big illusion that I, again, I think it's, I think it's a pretty cool idea. I think. Pun intended, we have to put a lot of energy into it to make it make sense as far as electric cars go, but I'm not, I'm not a huge proponent of them. Fair enough. Um, are your Englewood and Phoenix area stores also big indoor places? Yes. Okay. Yeah, so, um, the, uh That's kind of part of the model at this point. Effectively. Yeah, well, you know, whether, whether it's hot or cold or rainy or Um, or snowy or windy, you know, that you can still come look at a car and, you know, no pressure. It's really nice. You know, our, our guys are, you know, it's by design and I'm, I'm willing to say that out loud. Um, they all have their own independent offices. It's not like you're sitting out on the showroom floor and everybody hearing your credit worthiness and all the things that go into buying a car. Um, and it, and it, yes, that's part of the model. It, it's by design is to, we are different. It's a whole different process. Yeah. Um, by the way, I was gonna, uh, the, the swag Yeah. That you got there. You got a, a journal. I, I appreciate that. The, uh, the famous No Mistakes, everything Shake, uh, steak Shake. I appreciate that too. Uh, some patio cups and then you don't have to take those other things, but I ordered like a buttload of uh, uh, light. Uh, bottle opener keychains. All right. And I thought that you're a car guy, you can pass some local think tank keychains to some of your favorite people. Yeah, I'll spread them around. Or maybe just your crew, even. They always take the free stuff, you know. I'm the swag king of, of Northern Colorado, I don't know if you know that. No, I do now. Yeah, yeah. So, anyway, uh, there was something else I was going to ask you specifically about the car business, but, um, what do people not know? Uh, about, like, what are the skeletons in the closets of the traditional Auto business. So, I, I'm gonna Without naming names, obviously. I, well, I don't want to name names, and, and one of the things that, that I, you know, we, we, it's not my thing, but I, I am a defender of it. We, we definitely need those new car dealers, and so, um, we try not to openly bash their process and the things that they do, because, you know If you want a Honda, I got to be able to get a Honda and if our, you know, quote unquote competitors catch wind of us badmouthing them, well, then they're not going to want to play with us anymore. Um, but you know, one of the, one of the things that I, that I will say is, um, and, and most people probably recognize this usually later when the ether and adrenaline wear off is that, you know, that it's the second biggest purchase of a person's life. Right. And, and the, the system is designed. And I, and I'm guilty of being in it. I didn't, like I said, I've been, I've been in the car business since 2002 and, uh, I started with Centennial in 2009. Um, it's really about dry, you know, and, and there's a sale involved, or obviously it's, it's sales. Um, but, but it's really designed about getting you emotionally excited. And not, not thinking through what the process is. And, and that's where we really like to slow people down and go, okay, I know it's emotional, but that shouldn't be the driving factor of your purchase decision. It should be the end result. And so really that's, that's one of the things that we talk about a lot is that we don't, we don't really sell cars. It's a by product of the customer service that, that we truly do sell. Um, and that I, without going too deep into the rest of that, that's. That's about what I would say about it. Well, and because in a lot of situations, whether it's At a bank or a used car dealership, you know, you're just trying to strap on the finance rate and sell them credit insurance and all the different little bells and whistles that can, you know, make a little bigger commission check. Yeah. And, and, you know, we, we believe in a few of those products. We've got a fantastic service contract, um, second to none CNA, uh, that we've been partners with for over 20 years. And if you're. You know, not making an emotional decision over it. For some people, that's the best thing they ever bought. I mean, you know, yeah, absolutely. Especially when you, you know, I, one of my favorite things I've seen in my life was, uh, you know, at a sales meeting, it wasn't necessarily a presentation, but one of the owners pulled out a ream of paper and said, you know, this is all the claims that were paid last year by our CNA product, which they figured out. If you pay the claim, you sell more product. It's mind blowing. Yeah. As opposed to finding ways not to pay the claim and, you know, but the, a ream of paper of here's all the claims that were made and we sold, you know, call it 50% penetration on our clientele. So that means there's at least another ream of paper people that paid out of pocket for. Right. Right. And so, I mean, yeah. We're big fans of the right product. We're big fans of the right deal for our clients. And, and it, and it, that's that, that continual relational thing is what it's about. It's not about transactions. Talk to me if, if you have liberty, um, about like this transition in the organization, like there was like a few owners or a couple of few that company was started by two guys. Um, And, uh, a third, a third one, um, bought in, in 1988. Okay. Um, one of, one of the others, uh, I call it retired or just was bought out early 2000s before my time. Okay. And then, uh, um, so that leaves two owners going through, um, And then the, the o the, the one owner that I, I became really good friends with, uh, and, and a very good mentor of mine, um, was diagnosed with a LS in 2019. Oh. And he passed away in April. Okay. Of, of 23. Oh, wow. And so, um, the, the transition has really become, one of the original owners is still alive, but man, he's old. And I tell him every time I talk to him, um, but he's just, you know, he, he's tired and I don't blame him. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's been 40 years for him and, uh, and the last step into the shoes of this, of your mentor in some way. Yeah, yeah. Really. And, and really kind of a dynamic change to where, you know, there wasn't really defined roles as we have now. Um, and you're trying to take it to the next generation, really exactly. Like you added to the general manager role for the Northern Colorado. Yeah. Here we go for the whole operation. You know, we, nobody believes this until they see it happen, but you know, at least in Northern Colorado, a group of independent consultants, um, car sales guys read books together, um, you know, and it, we, we, we have a weekly discussion in our sales meeting right now. Uh, right now we're reading Be Your Future Self Now by Dr. Benjamin Hardy. It's a great book. It's cool. Um, but they're never sales books, or very rarely are they sales books. It's more human psychology, you know, time management, uh, business development, personal development type of stuff. Yeah. Because if we're better Then, then we treat our clients better and our clients like it and they tell their friends and they bring their friends and it just, it's just much easier. But in that one of the, one of my favorite books and one of the first books that was introduced to me, uh, as the, as the GM was good to great, uh, by Jim Collins out of Boulder. And, and I, you know, I've probably read that book once a year for the last eight years. Um, and, and truly it's, it's about, you know, how do we. You know, you think of companies like Wells Fargo, they've been around for over 200 years, right? Well, how did that happen? How many CEOs have they had? It's about having, you know, having a structure that really does follow time. And it's not about any one given person. It's about the systems and the processes and the service and the things that you provide. And so that's really what we're trying to do is can we continue this another 40 years? I'm going to do everything I can. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so that, that's really what the transition is about. Can I be nosy about, like, ownership structure and opportunity? Is that none of my darn business at this point? No, you can ask. Do those people that passed on and moved on, is there estates involved? Yeah, so I'm not involved in any of that. But yes, um, I'm aware of them. Um, I don't know numbers, I don't And I don't really care, because that's their business. Okay. Um, but, uh, going forward, you know, it's kind of a test drive, if you will, for the next two years for us. Okay. Uh, and then we'll start buying shares, uh, in 2026. Okay. This next series, you, you and the other two EVPs, kind of, will have a chance to buy Yep, and we're all under 50. into the stake. Yeah, we're all under 50, and we, and we work really well together. We have similar visions, so, yeah. It's quite a, uh, uh, place of Imagine, like, excitement, transition, opportunity, you know, both, uh, existential threat as well as the greatest opportunity of your life. Yeah. Oh man. You know, it's, it's one of those things that, you know, I'm, I'm a pretty ambitious guy, but I'm not, you know, it's not, it's gotta be done right. And uh, it's something that I. You know, I didn't really set my sights on until probably 2019 is like, whoa, these guys are getting up in age and not sure what they're going to do. And so I, you know, I just try to position myself and here we go. And I'm sorry about your, your mentor too. I mean, ALS is such a brutal thing to watch unfold. Uh, and you know, the most amazing person I maybe have ever met. Wow. The nicest guy, you know, at his, at his service, um, there was probably 400 people there. Yeah. And I sat next to a lady that just bawled her eyes out, um, and, and when the service was over, you know, I, I, I, I asked her, you know, how she knew him and, and she said, Oh, we dated once in high school. And I, I saw him online and you know, I, uh, I just, I saw him on Facebook and saw some things were going and, and, uh, and, uh, decided to, to, to follow up. Literally, literally one, one, one date or whatever, a prom date in high school and had that kind of impact on this lady. It was, it was quite profound. So you know, it's one of those things where it's like, man, when you look, you know, you look forward and go, you know, what am I going to be remembered by and what was my legacy? It's like, man, I hope to be half of that, you know, really important. What would you say his characteristics were at least that were most impactful to you? Um, really great listener, I mean, and, and quick on his feet to solve problems. And, you know, at time to time, as we all are quick to explode, he was dumb. No, no, he never did that, but I will tell you, he never admitted that he would admit his mistakes, but you know, my, probably my favorite story about him is, uh, and, and, and. At the old building in, in Fort Collins in mom's basement, that at some point they had finished some walls to create extra offices, but when they did that, they only did three quarter walls. Like they, they didn't connect to the ceiling. And so. Um, the, uh, you know, when I went into interview, when I finally said, okay, I'll put my name in the hat. They kind of put me through a business plan and how are you going to accomplish this and, you know, try and make a plan to go forward. And so I, I had never actually met the other owner until I went to interview with them. I had been in the top 20 of the, of the company. All six of my years with the company, but I'd never met him. And so, you know, when I walked in, uh, I was suited up. I took my tie off cause I was, you know, I was like, I'm way overdressed. So I took my tie off and I walked in and he was in a polo and jeans. And he's like, Oh, you do exist. And I was like. You do too, I guess? You know, but we sat and we talked and he asked me if I had an office to work out of at the building. And I said, well, kinda. Got these little three quarter wall bullshit. And my mentor says, well, no, you have an office. And I said, it's only got three quarter walls. And he says, no, it doesn't. It doesn't. I said, you want to bet? And so kind of left it alone, you know, so then April 1st of 2015, uh, he came in and told the other five guys that, you know, that they hired a manager and it was going to be me. And he could have heard a pin drop cause I was never at the office, but I sold a ton of cars. Right. And, uh, so the guys didn't really know me. And, uh, And, and then I, I kind of looked over his shoulder and I looked back at him and he fished out a dollar out of his wallet and he handed it to me because there are three quarter walls in that office. And so I framed that dollar. It's been in my office ever since. And he never asked me, he never asked me what that dollar was, but that was the first dollar I made as the GM working for a guy and beating him on a bet with a guy that never lost. I mean, he never lost. He, he, he, he was very strategic in his thinking and I just, you know, very, very good listener. Very intelligent. Yeah. Very intelligent. Were you able to put like windows in or anything to make those three quarter walls into proper? I did nothing with that office. I, all I did was every time an office moved out as soon as you could. Well, it took. It took six years. Um, but I, every, every chance that I, you know, whenever an office upstairs or down the hallway would open, I would snatch it up and put somebody in it. Um, you know, just trying to grow and trying to put more bodies in and, you know, so we just kind of cancerized the building and then ran out of, ran out of goodwill with our, with our neighbors, uh, with parking. Same, but different to building like a, uh, Northwestern mutual office or something like that. Right. All these people at different stages of life. They're a new chapter. Maybe I should sell cars. Yeah. And I get a lot of that and it's, that's another fascinating thing managing all these people is. is their level of expertise is widely varying. Right, right. You know, some of them know all of it, which is great. Yep. Um, we, we try very hard to enable them and, and, and teach them and educate them so that they have all the tools and Yeah, yeah. and information necessary. But some of them just have, you know, they're just good people and they, they're good people people, but they don't, they don't know anything. You know? My, uh, I'm actually, my friend Tony is coming out, uh, for a Colorado tour this year. He quit. Quit riding motorcycle because his buddy got killed on a snowmobile. Well, that'll do it. So he's, uh, he's in a Ferrari now and his college roommate, Zach, who was my weed dealer back in the day. Sure. Uh, they're gonna come tour with, uh, three of us on motorcycles. Nice. But Tony got into the car sales business while he was maybe second or third year of college. Sure. And, uh, you know, I'm working at The restaurant making 4. 50 an hour plus tips, right? Tony bagged like 45, 000 in like 15 hours a week his first year in car sales. Yeah, you can make, there's money to be made, you know, and it's not, that's kind of He was both a car nerd and really service oriented, really systematic, never wouldn't follow up. The guys that develop and understand a process and follow it You know, routinely and diligently. They, they just, they murder it, man. They it's, and it, and it, yeah, you can make a lot of money selling cars. He actually went into leasing sales. Eventually he started his own company doing leasing medical equipment. Sure. Sure. You can, you can also not make a lot of money. So, yeah. Oh yeah. No, you can starve to death too. You're doing it the wrong way or, or, you know, and, and that's, that's what I love about. That's what I, one of the things I love about Centennial is that because it's service oriented and it is about the client, you know It's not about today's transaction. I mean, I've often said You know, I'm I don't really care about this one. I care about the next one, right? Which means I better do this one, right? Yeah, you know and if I do this one, right? Then people come back and it's life's life's good. So I dig it. Um, we are going to jump in the time machine pretty soon here and go back to like your first grade year or something. Do you need a potty break or anything like that? No, I'm good. Uh, I've had this joint sitting here for like four weeks. You don't want that, right? Also good. Okay, I thought so. Uh, you know, I just try to, I try to, you know, serve. I'm here to serve. I appreciate that. Um, so let's do it. Whoop, whoop. Five years old. Where are you at? Uh. What's the scene? Well, well, uh, set the stage 1984, I guess, if that's right. Yeah. That, that seems like you were born in 79, it seems like. Yes. You're that much younger than me. Yeah. Damn. I wouldn't gu it to look at you I know. I look old. No, I'm kidding. Just very, you just act very mature, very wise. That's what I'm saying. Uh, yeah. I, uh, I was born in 79. Uh, I li I. I grew up in Colorado Springs, actually outside of Colorado Springs, a little town called Chapita Park. Which, uh, if you know where You're halfway up to Woodland Park, kind of. Woodland Park, yeah. So, uh, yeah, about, you know, what, a couple miles from the Pikes Peak Toll Road and Santa's Workshop. Um, and, uh, I played sports, soccer and baseball in Woodland Park and the Rec League. As a five year old? Well, all the way. No, I did. I played baseball. I went to college and played baseball. Tell me about the family, uh, dynamic there. Small family, big family? Yeah, so it's my parents and my brother, and that's it. Okay. grew up and my parents bought a cabin. Yeah, like, strange people, generally eccentric people buy cabins out in the woods. In the woods, and they're very much that. I love them to death, but they're, uh, just, just a brief snapshot. My mom was in Berkeley in 1969. Oh yeah. So I don't, I don't have to go much further than that, but, uh, I was actually named after, uh, Ian Anderson from Jethro Tull. That might also paint the picture a little bit. Um, and they're, and they're, they're amazing. Um, but they bought a cabin, a summer cabin in the woods, uh, and they'll shoot me probably, I think 74. I, I don't remember. I should, I wasn't there though. So, um, so, um, They moved, they moved from L. A. to, to, uh, from Hermosa Beach area, Redondo Beach area to, uh, get away from L. A. Um, and my, my mom's whole family is from L. A. My dad is, uh, my dad was born in Toronto, so I'm technically first generation American. Okay. I'm the oldest on both sides, uh, of all sides really, so I'm, I'm really the first generation American. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So a couple of hippies got together and moved to the mountains and here I am. So I went to Pauley Memorial Catholic School up across the street from the Broadmoor through 5th grade. Both my parents were laid off. So this mountain hippie kid is hanging out with all the richies. Yeah, I didn't fit either because we didn't have the money. Uh, you know, we were doing okay. We weren't, we were never, never well off, but never, never, never. What were they doing? They both worked for government contractors, Ampex and, uh, TRW. Okay. Um, and they both got laid off in the late eighties. Um, I, when I, I think when I was in fourth grade, that seems right. And then in, in sixth grade, we, they just couldn't afford it anymore. My mom went back to school to be a teacher and my dad went to manpower cause you got to find a job. Um, and he wound up landing a job with Lockheed Martin, which he eventually retired from. Yeah, yeah. Um, my mom went to, back to school to become an art teacher. She's an incredible artist. Yeah. Um, and all kinds of mediums, and uh, and uh, That sets the stage well, thank you. Yeah, if that gets, I And your brother's just a little bit younger than you? My brother, my brother's two years younger than me, two and a half years younger than me. Okay. Cool. And baseball, it sounds like, was a big part of your thing. I played baseball and college and soccer. Or, baseball and soccer in college. That's the right sentence. Um, yeah, I played two years of soccer and one and a half years of baseball in Crete, Nebraska. Uh, I played, I actually played soccer for Woodland Park because we didn't have a soccer team at Manitou, which is where I went to high school. Okay. Um, and then I played baseball at Manitou. Talk to me about soccer. We didn't have soccer when I grew up. Like, talk to me about the different positions. Uh, well It seems like kind of a basketball center thing. Kind of, kind of. Hockey is kind of different. The whole game Right, the defensemen stay back a little bit. Yeah, the whole game's triangles. It's all geometry. Okay. Um, which you don't find out until about high school. Yeah, yeah. You know, I don't know if you ever watched a bunch of five, six year olds play soccer, which I did play since I was about five. I've seen it, yeah, yeah. Uh, it's just everybody chasing the ball, but, but one, one day it just clicks that it's like, oh, we gotta work these angles. Yeah, yeah. And so So there's, there's a whole bunch of different sets, but you can go three, you know, there's 11 players on a team, uh, on a field at a time, usually, usually 20 or so, like on a college team. Um, and you'll, you know, you'll have two defenders and four midfielders and three forwards at whatever that breaks out. Um, and it just kind of depends on our people subbing in and out while the game is live. Not not like basketball. I mean, if the ball goes out of bounds or something, yeah, there's, there's times. Yeah. But, but really you've got to, you know. Be prepared for a long stretch of writing. Yeah, especially being a starter, which, you know, um, to kind of give you a set in the stage on this, I, my, my, my, I gotta think about this, my sophomore year of high school, I got a job popping popcorn. I was telling this story the other night and they were laughing at me. Um, there was a, there was a gourmet popcorn shop down at the bottom of the Pikes Peak toll road, which is about, it was about four and a half miles from my house. But if you know where I'm talking about, it was down the hill. Yeah. Yeah. So I could get to work. Then I could get to work at about. 30, 35 minutes. And it was fast, but then I had to go home. And so between my sophomore and junior year, uh, I, I got really fit. Um, and you know, cause I had to ride that stupid bike up that Hill. I got fast. I stole a lot of bases in baseball and I wound up being a left forward, which is the guy that feeds the ball into the middle. Right. Right. Um, and, and, you know, I, I was, I was a lot faster than I look now. Um. But, uh, it was a good game, and you know, I, I played, I played well enough to let her for three years, that's as long as they had it, at Wind, er, at, uh, Woodland Park. And, uh, I, I, I had the unfortunate luck of having the, uh, I was a second baseman, and the coach's son was a year older than me, and he was also a second baseman. Wow. And so I learned how to play every other position. Um, and then, uh, when I was a senior, the coach's nephew was a freshman and also a second baseman. And so I, I actually let, I was all state as a senior without a position. I was, I was mostly a pitcher. Uh, and then, um, we actually played a tournament up in Casper, Wyoming, and we just got murdered by the Legion team, uh, up in Casper, but they broadcasted over the. Over the AM radio and, uh, the next week I, I had a great set. We played four games and, and we got killed. It was like 15 to nothing, 14 to two. I don't remember the scores, but it was bad. And then the game that I pitched, we lost like nine to four, so it was, it at least kind of close, closer ish. But, but you know, I, I was playing every position and, and because it was on the air. Oh, really? They called my name out a lot. Right, right. And, uh, and, and His coach in Crete, Nebraska was listening. Literally the next Monday, I started getting phone calls from all over the Midwest saying, hey, come play for our school. Oh, interesting. Yeah. And you weren't like pursuing it or anything? No, I mean, I always, I mean, I still want to be a professional baseball player. You know? Yeah, me too. I, my, my Olympic dreams are just about shriveled away and gone. I think curling, maybe I could still, if I put a hard run on it now. I don't think my body's got the resilience left in it to be a world class golfer. Yeah, but you know, so, so I, you know, I went, I went to school to play baseball and try and figure out what I wanted to do with my life and, uh. And where's Crete? Crete, so Lincoln, Nebraska. Okay. Is, uh, Crete is about a half hour southwest of, of Lincoln. Okay, so it's like the, the, the cutesy. Private school, Catholic school too? No, liberal arts, but in private, but not far from Lincoln. And so it's kind of whatever. Party town. Um, and you know, what's crazy is the town at the time. I don't know. I haven't looked at the demographics, but at the time it was about 4, 000 people lived in that town and I, you know, realistically, even though the little town I grew up in was Chapita Park, I was always in Carl Springs, which was, you know, 800, 000 people at the time. So culture shock was a real thing. Right, right. Um, even Lincoln was way small. Yeah. But, but I would, but I, you know, I worked at the old Chicago in the Haymarket district. Um, when I wasn't at athletics, you know, as a bar back in a bus or just to make some money and get out of town. Um, and so I'd shoot into town and, and, you know, on a Saturday morning, there'd be a sea of red, whether the team was in town or not. And, uh, you know, a bunch of my buddies went to see you. So I, I was the instigator. I'd wear my CU hat and just bounce through the crowd, hucking a keg, you know? Yeah. Um, but no, it was, you know, it was, it was a good experience. Uh, it talked me out of college. College talked me out of college, which was a fun thing. Oh, uh, no degree. Uh, I was, uh, I had a macroeconomics class was on the other side of campus at eight o'clock on Friday morning. And I never went, you know, I got C's my micro and macro one Oh one and one Oh two or whatever. Uh, and then I had, um, a really excellent professor, uh, James. Dobkins, Dobbins, Dobbins, something like that. Anyway, he, he taught us about like marginal economics of a keg party. He used like the example of, you know, do you buy one more keg or not and stuff. And just other examples, like he worked in the real world for a while. And one thing I realized is that I fuckin don't like academics. I don't either. Like real academics that are just academics. Yeah. They are so dumb sometimes. I didn't realize it until much later. Yeah, yeah. Until it was forced on me. But that teacher, like, spun my awareness and then all of a sudden I'm like, oh, I fuckin understand all of economics now. So if you're stuck with it, I'm convinced that you could have figured it out, cause you seem smarter than me. Well, so, thanks. I don't, I don't know. Um, I, I, I could tell you as luck would have it, it was a, it was a, it was an attendance based class that I never went to. And finally one day I was like, you know, I probably should go and check out what's going on. And, and my luck has always been not good. And so I walk into a pop quiz. And, uh, and I, and I get over 90%, I, I don't remember the score, but I, I, I got an A on it on a class that I never went to and never studied for. And in that same class, the lesson was about opportunity cost and what it costs you to be anywhere at any given time. And I started doing the math in my head and I'm like, so I'm failing out of a class that I completely understand. And I'm. Paying to do this and I checked out that day and I ruined a lot of lives because I wasn't, I am first generation American So I was required to go and live the paradigm of going to college. Interesting, so you're a huge disappointment still? Or now that you're like this executive VP? You know, I'm not, I'm not gonna comment on that. You'll, your mom won't listen. I'll plead, I'll plead the fifth. I don't, I don't think so. I think they're, I think they're pretty impressed with where I've gotten without a college degree. I suspect so too. Did your brother get a college degree? Yeah. So he was able to carry that mantle instead. Yeah, yeah. He, uh, he went to CSU and has an English degree from there. Is he doing anything with it? No. Well, then I guess you proved you right. You know, I, it's, uh, that's a, that's a nice segue, which I'll, I'll take control from you for a second. But that's a, that's a nice segue from, uh, You know, one of the things that I, I really am passionate about that I'm doing is, you know, not everybody belongs in college. Um, I, I really want my doctor trained and I really want my lawyer educated. Yeah. Engineers should know a lot about that. You know, and I can even get behind say construction management or things of that nature. But when it really boils down to it, especially in the, in the new age, um, of technology that we live in, you know, it's not really necessary to get an English degree. You know, as an employer myself, I don't, I don't really care about a resume. I much more care about your expertise and your ability to deal with people than I do about whatever that piece of paper says. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and so. You know, I, I, I just, I think, I think a lot of people, um, they just don't know. I think a lot of kids don't know what they want to be when they grow up. I don't know what I want to be when I grow up. Um. And if you don't know, probably maybe don't go to college. Well, so that's, that's, you know. Take a gap year or something. What's it called if you can't bankrupt out of your debt? Do you know the term? Slavery? It's close. It's called indentured servitude. Right. It's very close. And so one of the things that, you know, I, I'm, I, I'm a, I don't believe in and I think it's a big problem is, is that they don't, they don't teach world finance or life finance at the high school level. Yep. Um, and no one warns anyone to say hey. Right. This, this is happening. Hey, if you borrow$45,000 a year to go to this college, you're gonna pay it back after five years, you're gonna owe$200,000. Yeah. And you can't ever get rid of it. And, and, and you better work your ass off or else you'll never pay it off. Right. Um, and then that's what, you know, that's where you kind of get into. Okay. So how, how necessary is, say, an English degree? I, I can't think of an application that it's necessary. I mean, even being, even being an English professor, I don't, and I, you know, well, and most. Of the, what you would need to know to have an English degree. Is already publicly available. See, and so this has been my argument, right? I want my doctor trained, I want my lawyer educated. And you can tell I've recited this a lot. But, you know, if you want an Emily Dickinson degree, you can get it for free online. For sure. You can, you can educate yourself. Read a bunch of shit. All different ways. Read a bunch of shit. And never, and never spend a real money on it. You know, you can, you can buy books and invest your time, but you're never going to spend real dollars on it and get just as far. Yeah. Yeah. So what did you, and I want to come back to this cause I know this is a passion with the like Home Builders Association or something like that. Is that right? Yep. Um, but like in line with the story, what did you do? You dropped out of school and then what? Uh, well, that's, yeah, I took a, I'll say it's a detour, it's, I don't know that it is. I, uh, I dropped out of school and I, I moved home for a solid So you're like mid semester, you're like one and a half semesters in, or two years in, or something. Um, I, you know, and I'll, I'll, I'll go back in the time machine, it'll be like a little flashback in the story, but I packed my things up and I, and I moved out and I moved home and I lived, I I lived at home for maybe a month. I mean, it wasn't very long, you know, going, you're like mid semester here. Yeah. I call it like February, March. Oh, wow. Yeah. Um, and, uh, so I came home and, and I had the job at old Chicago, which I actually got from working at old Chicago and Colorado Springs. And so, you know, I, I, when I moved out there, I was like, can you help me transfer and get a job there while I'm there? And they're just sure. So they made it happen. So then I came back and I got a job working back at old Chicago. Um, and I started out as a. As a host, which I used to wear a name tag that said little Debbie on it. So when people came in, well, I just, you know, what's that mean? I said, well, I'm better than a hostess, you know? Um, and so, but, but I worked my way up through the ranks to working as a bartender pretty fast and then, um. I had two best friends growing up and we're still best friends. The three of us kind of brothers, uh, one joined the coast guard and the other went to mines as an engineer when we were, when we were in middle school, he was taking college level classes at math classes. He's just a math genius. Um, so he was going to mines and. The other two of us, I dropped out of school and my other, my other buddy was just kind of screwing around and, uh, and we're like, we got to get out of this town. So we moved to Wheat Ridge, um, and, uh, and I, where there was also an old Chicago, which is, which is a, how did you choose Wheat Ridge? Well, it's a few blocks from the school in Golden, straight up, straight up, straight up. Chicago just down the street for you, literally, literally four buildings down. Like we were less than a block away from the old Chicago. And, uh, and so I moved, you know, I moved to that job and quickly took over the head bartender of that. You know, there was four, there was four bartenders. They all lived in my house a block from the bar. You know, we were all 21 ish and, uh, it was the time of our lives. Um, but, uh, you know, I, I, I realized, you know, and this is the, this is the flashback. Um, a good friend of mine went to see you, became friends with a pretty well known vinyl DJ. Oh. Uh, in Denver, named D. J. Jones. And, uh, he wound up on KS 107 5. And, uh, I met him, and I'm like, Hey, that's pretty cool, I wanna try that out. So I sold my first car, my first personal car. Cause I wasn't, there was no way my 83 Subaru station wagon So you live right by the Well, this was before, this was when I was in college. Okay. There's no way my 83 Subaru station wagon's making it to Crete, you know. So it stayed at home, and I rode the train. I always rode the train back and forth from Denver. Oh, wow. And so You know, one day I was like, well, I was like, I think I want to buy some turntables. And so I called up DJ Jones. I was like, do you have any turntables? Yeah. So I sold my own car for enough money to buy turntables in like my first crate of records. And I carried those in a duffel bag back to my dorm room at college. Um, and so while I was there, I, I ran a Friday night radio station show on, on the KDNE, the time that you've been behind a microphone. This doesn't bother me. Um, but I, so I hosted the Friday night show to try and keep me out of trouble, right? Cause everybody was at the parties and I was like, ah, at least if I'm on the radio, I won't be at the party, you know? So I wound up having a pretty popular show that people would call into and, and I played all kinds of hip hop and R& B at the time. Cause that's what was hot and that's what I liked. And, um. So then fast forward back, when I moved to, when I moved to Denver, to Wheat Ridge, uh, I brought my records and, you know, started making way more money than I should, you know, we were making so much money in tips and we had, our rent was like 200. My car payment was 200 and, you know, we're making like 1, 500 a week. Um, and, uh, so yeah, which in those days was like a lot, a lot of dollars, right? You had no outgo, no, no kids, no bills, just. You know? So, you know, we'd go on four, five, six hundred dollar record shopping sprees every week, and I, I, I quickly built up, I got about, I still have them, I still have about 8, 000 vinyl records in my basement. Oh my goodness! Are those, are they worth what you paid for them? No, I highly doubt it. I mean, I've got some, I've got some good stuff. I've got some, you know, I've got some collections from friends and parents, friends and friends, parents and, um, you know, but, uh, you know, I, I realized that I really liked, I really liked spinning the records. And so I started spinning records in Boulder, uh, at both at the foundry and at, at a club that's long gone called the players club. Okay. Um. And, uh, and, and it was just like the, the cool chicken chicken drop records and make girls dance. Yeah. Oh yeah. And this is well before talking and singing and no, no, I mean, you know, I get on the mic and blend over stuff or whatever and talk overs or whatever, but not, not really. It was really just more about, you know, what we learned was there was a way to sequence the music to where. people would like, take a break and go get a drink. And so the bartenders and the servers and the cocktail servers, they loved you. If you, if you were able to keep the drinks coming, get them dancing for the dancing, cause that gets them thirstier when they take a break and then you just play a little slower record and there's a little, you know, there's a little. So I, you know, I learned how to control the crowd from that, and I really, really enjoyed that. Um, there's nothing, there's nothing like being in a club full of, you know, 500 sorority girls and dropping the crossfader and taking the volume down and they're all singing. At the same time to the song you're playing and then you flick the thing back up the, you know, the crossfader back up and, and they're all right on beat and the place blows up and it's, there's nothing like that feeling. I can imagine. I can't actually imagine, but it sounds pretty cool. It's pretty amazing. Especially if there's 500 sorority girls all looking at you, big guy. Yeah, hot blonde sorority girls. It was quite something. So, you know, so, you know, at the time, uh, My, my wife of God, we're on paper, we're 18 years deep. Um, but at the time, you know, she was really good friends with, we, we went to kindergarten together, believe it or not. Okay. Um, and then, uh, Your little Catholic school thing. Yeah. Yeah. And then, uh, reconvened and we didn't, you know, we didn't really know it, but we reconvened when we were juniors. She moved to Manitou and, um. Um, she was friends with all my friends. Oh, she was with you this whole time? As you're like, college drop outing? Yeah, well, we were just friends. Oh, you were just buddies? We didn't date in high school. She had one solid boyfriend, and I had a lot of girlfriends. Um But, uh, she used to come to the club, you know, and come hang out and, and it'd be funny cause like, you know, the servers, especially the girls would be like all jealous and trying to drive a wedge between us. Cause then we just, it just kind of naturally happened. We started dating cause she used to come hang out while it was spinning and we'd go out, you know, jump over a fence at apartment complex after the club and hop in somebody's, Hot tub or whatever, you know? And, uh, and uh, so we just kinda, you know, you could ask her too. There's, there's no, there's no definite, like, anniversary date. There wasn't like a start time. Nah, it just kinda happened. It was like, oh, turns out we're naked in this stranger's hot tub. Are we dating? We're together now. Yeah. So we, uh, anyways, you know, she used to come to the club and hang out. And, uh, and so we, you know, those, those servers would come up to me and Hey, your girl's dancing with that guy. And I'm like, I got these records to carry and she's going to be here when the place closes. Yeah. So, you know, we, so we, we, uh, I had a falling out with my roommates in, in Boulder. I wasn't making enough money. I stopped bartending and moved from Wheat Ridge to Boulder to try and pursue this and try and make it, you know, make a living out of it. And I don't know if you ever tried to live in Boulder. It's very expensive. Yeah. Always has been. And that was the problem that you could make as much money as you were back in the day, but Well, I couldn't make near the money. I was making bartending, but I really want to spin records. No, weren't you making a bunch of money spinning records in the early days? No. That was bartending money. Yeah, bartending money was, was, was where it was at. Um, so I, uh, I, uh, I got a job. selling life insurance, basically door to door. And, uh, the office was down on Hampton and I 25 and I was living in Boulder and you know, I was working, you're still working at the bar a little bit, still spinning records. There's been a lot of times in my life I've had two jobs, so this isn't that scary for what I'm about to embark, but maybe I don't have as much energy as I used to, but we'll see. Um, but I, you know, so I, I was still spinning records a couple nights a week and then driving down. Literally every day, except Sunday to the office on Hampton and I 25 going through a sales meeting and then going out to appointments. And if the appointment didn't show, then you knock on doors and try and sell live insurance. Um, and uh, and eventually I had this falling out with my roommates and I can't say I was entirely homeless, but I was kind of in my car for a week and my wife, who kind of my girlfriend Cause they kicked you out. Yeah. Basically. You're not paying rent. You gotta go. You know? And so, and that's fine. I, I don't blame him. I, I'm not mad at him. I get it. Um, so then, then, you know, my wife caught wind of it. And again, at the time, who was kind of your girlfriend? Kind of my girlfriend, kind of, you know, so I, I wound up moving. She didn't have any other boyfriends? Not at the time, no. She was, she was. That's good. Yeah, no. So, you know, I, I moved in with her at her apartment in Greeley and, and still made the commute to Oh, wow. To Hampton and I 25 for about six months. And, uh, um. Um, then it just long story made sure it was just really a MLM multi level marketing hack shack. And I learned a lot. I mean, I learned so much there, but, uh, I just, yeah, I was like, not only that, but just, you know, the, you would start, you know, in the training you would start with. Really nice neighborhoods, affluent clients, people that understood the value, have the money to pay for the supplemental products that we sold. And then as you got closer to your renewal dates, when you would start making money on the policies you sold, they'd start moving you to crappier and crappier neighborhoods to the point where the day I quit, I pulled into a, uh, a mobile home park on, on North federal. And, uh, and, uh, I pulled in and there was a brand new Tahoe with a, what we call happy tags in the car business, brand new tag on the, on the, on the bumper of it. And uh, and I pulled in and, and the guy wasn't there yet. He was a framer. He worked as, you know, as the framing for, for houses. And he wasn't there yet. He was coming home from work, but I met his wife and they're like nine kids and she didn't speak a word of English. Right. Not like, all Spanish, like, and I spoke enough Spanish, I used to speak a lot of Spanish. But, uh, I spoke enough Spanish to be like, okay, well we'll hang out. And then I could kind of do the presentation until they trusted me and then I'd go, You speak English, right? And then they'd break them open and we could have a conversation. But, you know, the guy pulls up in a Navigator with a happy tag on it. And then I go through this whole presentation, and he goes, I can't afford it, and I'm like, bro, He's got 900 a month in car payments. If there's anyone that can afford it, it's gotta be you, right? What's gonna happen if you die, and they're gonna deport your family, you can't pay for anything, they're ruined. And he's like, I can't afford it, I can't afford it, I can't afford it, and And if, uh, of all the people I ever met needed it, it was him and he, there was no chance. And so I packed up my stuff and stopped. So I was sitting on the couch at our, at our apartment in Greeley and, uh, in the classifieds. I was looking for a job cause that was still a thing in the newspaper. Right, right. And, uh, the votes circuit me. This is like 2000, 2002. Five two. Okay. Two. Um, the, uh, you know, the, uh, the Volkswagen store in Greeley was hiring, Erlich was hiring. Okay. And we had A-A-T-D-I, uh, diesel Jetta, yeah. Was one of our cars that we had. And I was like, well, I like driving that. I a golf TBI for a while. Yeah. I, I could sell that. I liked that car. So I went and interviewed and Really? No previous car? Nothing. No. But I had a lot of. Sales experience, you know, and so, um, you know, my first day was November 1st, 2002. And the rest, I guess, is history. I had a lot of different jobs at dealerships and wound up at Centennial in 2009. You were there, and then at Centennial you started when? 2009. 2009. So eight years later, seven years later, something like that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yep. And uh, and got a good education. So I guess in the short answer, I went to work to get a business degree. I, I don't know how else to say that. Like I, I was, I told, and that's what I told my family. I was like, I'm not, I'm not going to give somebody money to teach me how to do this. Yeah. I'm going to go learn how to do it on my own. When you think about, at least about your business, uh, what do you think are like the top three things that, that Are most important for, for you and your role in your leadership role, maybe as the GM or since you're brand new in this EVP kind of thing. I don't even know how to answer that. We, we had a staff meeting last week to try and decide what I do so I can try and delegate some stuff. You know, we've got a, we've got an amazing title clerk and we've got a fantastic business manager and, and our, our recon guy for our used cars is amazing and, and, and I really, you know, I'm the general manager, which just makes me a janitor. I mean, that's a little bit. I think what some people don't understand is that being like the executive, the CEO or whatever you want to call yourself, GM, EVP, is you kind of have to be a little bit good at a lot of things. Yeah, you want me at trivia. Don't ask me one specific thing very far, but I can give you a lot of trivia. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's probably the, that's probably the best answer is you got, you got to know a little bit about every angle and, and really when it comes to managing people, you got to understand what. Each of them needs, what if they're being driven by, there's not one, there's not one cure all for all of them. They all have a different, and just being able to handle that is probably the best way to put that. Um, what, uh, what's the dumbest thing you've seen, uh, in business or done if you want to share that story? Um, I don't, wow. Uh, I've seen a lot of dumb things. Uh, I don't even know how to answer that, Kurt. Sorry, it was kind of an off the wall question. Yeah, no, I don't, I don't, like, I don't even know how to answer that. I, you know, I, uh, I, I, I wish I'd have known about what we do, you know, five years earlier. Uh, as far as Centennial versus the industry. But I also am a very, very well aware that had I not had the experiences that I've had, I wouldn't have landed where I am. Fair. So, um, I, I don't know, there's, there's too many to list, and there's a lot of dumb things that happen. Any, uh, any dumb stories around, like, cars getting driven over by trucks or dropped off in the wrong place or anything like that? Yeah, yeah, I had a, I had a truck that, uh, You know, and, and call it, you know, I don't remember it was a 16 or 17, uh, it was like a year old with like 12, 000 miles on it that we bought for a client in North Carolina and it didn't clear the bridge and transport. Oh. So, but the whole A pillar, which is where the windshield attaches was smashed in and it, and it hit. Just shrunk it down a little bit. It hit so hard. Well, all there was glass all in the vents. I mean, the car was trashed, but it hit so hard when it hit the bridge that it smashed the entire exhaust system. Whoa, I mean it the guy had to be going 80 and it did not clear the bridge So it just wrecked this truck interesting. Just like squatted it down. Yeah underneath there. Yeah That was that was not nothing. That was pretty crazy. I also watched the transport guy You know the guys that deliver the new the new cars from the the railhead if you will So when a brand new car shows up to the dealership I watched the guy roll one off the top deck of a double decker transport like roll it The car fell off the top, yeah. That was pretty impressive. Yeah, that guy is looking for a new job potentially. He never came back. Never saw him again? I think that's appropriate. Um, I've got a little bit more whiskey here if you want it. Yeah, I'll go with a little more. Okay, I'm just pouring a little tiny halfers or whatever. Yeah, it's perfect. I gotta go to baseball practice this evening too. Yeah, you can't have too much. Too much whiskey bresset. Well, it's not for me, it's for my 11 year old. Well, yeah, that's what I'm saying. But I still gotta go catch him, and he throws it hard. And your, and your 11 year old's friend's dad. No, it's just him. Oh, you don't even care about that? No, he's, no, that's, he's going to a one on one training. Oh, cool. So is he following in his dad's footsteps? He's gonna take it farther maybe? I don't know. I, you know, God, I wish we would have had the things that these kids have. I hate to sound like an old man. Well, what you need is a really big ass hill for him to have to pedal up for an hour and a half every day. I tell that to a lot of friends, like, you know, I've got a friend that their kids He's probably 6'6 and he's a sophomore, and he's a truck, and, uh, but he, but he's, he's a big, lunky teenage kid, you know, he, no footwork, and I'm like, man, you wanna, you wanna get fast? I know, I know the hill by your house, I know what you gotta do. Drag you up, down that thing a bunch of times. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, let's, uh, let's talk about the, uh, let's make the turn into the faith family politics segment of our podcast. Okay. Uh, where do you want to start? Um, you know, I'll, I'll, I'll make I'll make, uh, I'll make the religion, I know you didn't say that. Yeah, I say faith because I think religion's kind of gross. It is. To me, faith is better. That's fair. I, um. Not always, but yeah. You know, again, being a stat guy, I, uh, I don't think it's mathematically possible for us to have a theological conversation without something turning the light switch on. Okay. I, it just, it doesn't make, it just doesn't jive. Oh, yeah, some kind of a prime, the prime mover, as Aristotle would have called it. The, the, the unmoved mover. Yeah, so, that being said, I was born and raised Catholic, uh, I think there's a lot of holes in that story, because that's the That's my take on it. Seems like a pretty successful power grab to me, if I look at it in the big lens of history. Yeah, yeah, well, and they did it, they did it really well. You know, Louis C. K., the comedian, he had a bit, and I, and I don't remember which thing it was on, but he talked about how, you know, he teaches his kids to respect all religions, but mostly the Christians. Okay. Because they won. And he goes, you don't believe me? What year is it? Right. Like, okay, that's fair. Yeah, that was, uh, that was a pretty funny meme I saw on Twitter the other day. It was, uh, this is 2024. Like you're, Religion doesn't matter here anymore. And the responder was like 200, 2024 years since what exactly? So that being said, the Muslims are kind of winning now. Like they're going to have Europe soon. They definitely have the population control for sure. Right? I mean, if they have. Seven kids to every 1. 5 for all the Irish people and shit like that. Ain't gonna be long before that's Muslim land. You know, so that being said, I, I, I try to stay away from it because it's, it's, it's, it's deeply personal for a lot of people. I've met a lot of people that hide behind their religion. Um, in my, in my life that, you know, they use it as a shield to be kind of a sheep in wolf's clothing or a wolf in sheep's clothing. Yeah, my, uh, my friend Larry used to say, uh, you know, I don't know much, but I know if somebody says, you can trust me, I'm a Christian, that I cannot trust that person. Yeah, yeah, you know, in a funny segue, or a funny aside to that, not segue, but I've got a, uh, one of my consultants worked for a place before, uh, before he came to me, that the guy was one of those, like, Bible thumping, hardcore Christians. And, and literally would, would screw people out of whatever he could. Right. And then he comes and works for me and we're a bunch of quote unquote heathens, but we're the most honest people he's ever met. Right, right. You know, it's, it's, I always laugh when he tells that story, but, you know, my, my take is, and it, it, it's, it's, you gotta, you gotta, I mean, we're getting to know Ian right here, but. Sure. Yeah. I don't feel like I have enough ego to say that the Christian God is right, or the Muslim God is right, or the The Hindu one. Whatever. Like, whatever, whatever version of it it is, we don't know anything. Right. I just, like, like I said, I started with, there's no, it's mathematically impossible for us to have a conversation about theology. Yeah, something created this. Yeah, one in a trillion zeros. I mean, it's just not possible. Well, and, you know, one thing that I appreciate, whether it's Hindu Jewish Christian, you know, the, the Judeo Christian ethic is having a code that you should live by, you know, and, you know, those, those hypocritical, yeah, exactly, because if, if there isn't, like, kind of rules, you know, like, uh, Peterson's Twelve Rules for Life, it wouldn't be surprising if you did that as a book club thing, right? It's not specifically religious or faith oriented, it's informed by, and, um, it's, If it isn't for that, it's whatever the government says is the rules is the rules, and that's for sure going to be worse. Yep. No, absolutely. You know, that, that's one of the things, the first time I read that book, uh, one of my, one of my best friends, uh, killed himself in 2020, and, and a friend, another friend of mine handed me that book, The Twelve Rules for Life, and, and I probably shouldn't have pulled it out of it, but that's, that's exactly the, the message that I got out of that book was, you know, Whether or not it was written by the hand of God, right? The Bible, you mean? The Bible. Um, or, or the Koran, or the Torah, or any of them. Whether or not it was, it's still about organizing chaos. There was some really smart dudes going, Man, we gotta curb this. Well, and the symbolism of a, of a garden that's protected and, you know, this is They, they were, they were well beyond their years, again, whether the hand of God wrote it or not, it's, it's a pretty empowerful When you see some parts of society In today's realm and, you know, the relative breakdown of law and order in certain places and different things and who, you know, some people can get away with things that other people cannot get away with things and stuff like that. Like that's chaos ultimately sprouting. Exactly. And, and I know, I know that wasn't like, that wasn't the main message of that book, but I'm like, that makes so much sense. Yeah. See what he's saying. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, I, I, like I said, I try and shy away, I mean, I'll have a conversation about religion, but I, I, I respect everyone's opinion on that. So you've exited formal Catholic faith and have you ever explored mainstream Christian faith or whatever, any other church? No, I, again, my, you know, and I, I, my mom, my mom is so Catholic that when she went back to school to be a, Uh, art teacher. She wound up at St. Mary's Catholic High School as an art teacher for 20 years. So, well, maybe not quite that long. Yeah, it was probably about that long, actually. Um, very, very Catholic. Um, and, and I know she's always a little disappointed that I've chosen the path that I have. Um, but I just, I just, like you said, I, I, I'm, it's not a doubting Thomas thing, it's, it's not a, it's not, it's not a, I'm just skeptical about, I'm, I'm skeptical about the, the, the evil that men do and the organization itself. That, that's, that's kind of Yeah, yeah, no, that's, I mean, if I have a basic life philosophy, it's that Power concentrations always corrupt, you know, and so like my wife and I choose to go to a very small church That's loosely affiliated with a very small network. Yeah, you know and if I had my way Very small power concentrations is what everybody should choose. You know, I, I always find, you know, the, the most, the most spiritual moments that I have are, you know, when I'm standing in a river fly fishing by myself and there's nothing else there and the river's You know, the rivers bubbling and the, the, the, the dogs or whatever have the, the mountain line cornered. It's like, wow, I, I, this, this is existence. I, that, that I find more spiritual than anything else. We might turn this, uh, toward the family category, but you have smalls? Yeah, I've got an 11 year old and an eight year old. And, like, what's their perspective on faith in the moment? Uh, I don't know that they really have one, and that, you know, I could be judged for that both ways. Um, we really, you know You haven't explored together, gone to a No! Never go to a church for a Christmas Eve service? No, they've been, they've been with Grandma. Sure. You know, they've been with Grandma. So they've got one little narrow lens. Yeah, you know, the biggest thing to me is without the politics that go into all the religions, if you really boiled down the basic morals and ethics that are taught now pretty much the same. And so that's really what we focus on. Yeah. You know, the Ten Commandments are. Kind of the 10 commandments for all, all of us, so that's really more than the avenue we've taken. Um, they, they, I don't know, I don't, I don't want to corrupt them either way. I'll, I'll let them choose freely, but I don't, I don't only bash religion or, or faith with them. We just, what's a good, what's, what, what's it to be a good citizen? What's it going to be a good person in the community? Yeah, that's fair. And I have a prediction. Uh, six years from now you're going to be going to church. I don't think so. You don't think so? No. Too sour? Yeah, I just don't see it. Just don't want to be, you're not a joiner. You know, the last time, I'm not a joiner. If there's anything that you can, my wife will probably tell this, you know, whenever you ask her, she says, the one thing that I'm terrible at is jumping through other people's hoops. Yeah, yeah. I don't do it. If there's It's kind of funny but if there's one thing you might be part of local think tank because that's like one of the Consistencies of our membership is most of them aren't even in the chamber. They're not in realities for show them They're just not really joiners. Yeah, no, you know and then they you know saw this anyway, yeah No, it's it's it's yeah I'm gonna choose my own path and I'm gonna I'm gonna do it as as well as I can and and and it matters You know, it matters It matters the legacy that I leave for my kids. It matters the legacy that I leave for humanity. You know, I, I, I can, I can spin that back to the workforce development thing. Oh yeah. Um, you know, I, if we all remember the fires of 2020, both figurative and literal, uh, I've got an, I've got a. Uh, property, a house that I bought in Windsor, uh, right before I bought it in December of 2019. So right before everything went through the ceiling, we got a steal on the house. It's way too big a house. I never would have bought that much house, but it's on about an acre of property, a little bit over. And uh, I was, I was, I was beer infused epiphany of by myself in August or so of 2020 staring at the sun. Cause I could through the, if you recall, the smoke and, and, and as I'm staring at the sun, I watched the earth rotate, not the sunset, but literally the earth rotate. And it was like, holy cow, it is a big round world. Um, and not that I'm a flat earther, but you know, I, I realized that, you know, there's nothing we can do about Moscow or Beijing. There's nothing I can do about Washington. There's, you know, I'm always fighting with policy in Inglewood. So from that, it's a very flat earth, and what can I touch? And so, from there, this hour long monologue, dialogue with myself, I get to the end of this conversation and go, How do we, how did we get here, and what can we do? Right? And ultimately, I think the, that's, that's a very spiritual conversation with yourself. I, it happens, bro. Yeah, yeah. Um. Well, and was it you? Did you tell me about that at lunch at Penrose or something? Maybe. Cause I've been talking about, like I've been trying to get my guest to say I'm a flat earther. No, I'm not a flat earther. Because I've been talking about, well, but I've, I've been, It might have been me. Well, I've been couching it in that space of, you know, when you look at the world, I don't think it was you, but it's. It's fascinating that we're on this same topic because I've been describing myself as a, as a flat earther because I want to pay attention to the parts of the earth that look flat to me from here. Yeah, well, that's, that was the way I got to that. Yeah, yeah. You thought, right? I don't know if we just resonated on that and came to the same place or what. Possibly. Anyway, you might have mentioned it. I thought it was novel and I've been talking about it on the podcast. I hope it was me. I hope I planted that seed. I can't say it was me. Um, so anyhow, you know, I get to this, I get to this decision in my mind that the problem, the real problem with, I mean there's a lot of problems with the world, but the one that I, I can put my hands on the book. Um, is, is my wife has been education for 23 years. Okay. Um, she's been a counselor for 14 of them. Okay. Uh, she went, she went to UNC, got her double major, uh, as an, an undergrad and then wound up going back to CSU to get a counseling degree. And, um, What I, what I've seen is that the current system does not allow for a counselor to be a guidance counselor. Meaning they, they're always doing, uh, registrations and testing and, uh, scheduling and threat and suicide assessments and they never have a chance to say, Hey, look, kid, you're good with your hands. What do you actually want to do? Don't go to college, be a plumber, right? I mean, like, like I've seen it, I've watched it happen. And so. You know, with my experience that we just talked about, it's one of the things that it's like, well, I know that, you know, am I where I want to be? No. Am I closer? Yes. Uh, in my personal life, but, but, but I'm walking proof that there is another path. And so I have this conversation with myself and go, okay, what we got to do is we got to knock over the university system as it sits today. Sure. It's a small task. You don't have to knock it over, but replace it. Or revamp it, whatever. Provide a substitute for it. Change direction. It's doomed otherwise. Too much overhead. Well, there's a lot of slaves. There are a lot of slaves. Indentured servants. That's the right term. Indentured servitude. I go into the HBA, which I, I can, I can tell the story why we're there. Um, but I'm on the membership committee there with the, you know, for the Homebuilders Association. Yeah, sorry. Uh, for Northern Colorado Homebuilders Association, um, which initially it was like, well, there's a lot of companies there. They buy cars. We sell cars, kind of shooting fish in a barrel. Let's go. So that's why I joined and, and, and met with, you know, a few people and wound up on the membership committee, which was also a great place. Cause when people, when people join like we're kind of like a big brother type of thing, I get to meet everybody, you know, give us more about your business and you need to replace those feet. Really easy. So, so from that, we, uh, you know, I go into a membership committee meeting like the next day, I mean, it was, 2020 was rough. After this, like, smoky, like, out of my body epiphany experience, God speaking to you kind of thing. And I go off on this long winded half hour tangent about how we gotta fix the world, and, uh, And they, the, the, the executive director at the time looked at me when she went, you're the guy. I'm like, well, what do you mean? And she says, well, we've kind of been exploring this idea of creating a workforce development committee. And, and you seem like you're the guy and I was like, all right. So that was like, yeah, well, I can't shut my mouth sometimes. But I, uh, so I was like, all right, so that was about August of, of 2020. And, uh, the home builders association puts on the parade of homes. Um, and that's always in September. So I was like, well, let's get through that. And then it was award season. And so, uh, come March, it was like, all right. We're going to create this committee. You're going to be the chair, go to work and, and do whatever you want to, um, figure it out. And so I, you know, I made a lot of phone calls and I met with a lot of people trying to do the things, you know, similar things and trying to figure out a path for, for, for the association. And, uh, In that conversation with a lot of people, I wind up meeting with, uh, with, uh, with a company, uh, uh, uh, an entity, it's a, it's a nonprofit out of Colorado Springs called Careers in Construction Colorado, C I C C, and about the fourth email Well, let me, before I get there, the, uh, that, that was born as a committee out of the HBA in Colorado Springs. Gotcha. And so, me being the lazy, how do we do this, the smartest, it's most efficient, at least worked for me. Why rebrand this? Let's just adopt this program and install it in northern Colorado. And at the time, there was about Uh, there's about 32 schools in the state and like 2, 200 kids, uh, enrolled in the program. And, uh, about the fourth email back and forth with their executive director and a couple other people, I get this side email from him and he says, Hey, did you happen to go to Manitou Springs High School? And I, I look at it and I go, holy shit, that's Mr. Hart. He was my health, biology, and anatomy teacher when I was in high school. And I'm like, watch these stars align. Guess what we're doing, guys? We're following this path. And so it, it really was him. And, and now we've made really good friends, you know, post my high school. I, you know, after talking to him, like, do you remember? He's like, yeah, I remember that. And I'm, do you remember my wife? Yeah, I remember your wife. You remember all my friends? Yeah, I remember. Wow, that's crazy. So, you know, so we get together. Plus he's like anatomy biology. Like what the hell is he doing in this construction career? His dad, his dad was a home builder. Okay. His dad was a home builder. And, uh, and what he told me when we first started talking and it makes so much sense is that, you know. He was the principal of Manitou for years after, you know, after I was gone. And, and one of the things that when this program was presented to him by the Home Builders Association that really rang was he like had a scrolling list of kids that had gone through the school that never had an opportunity like this. That. He's like, man, that kid would have fit like you went off to college somewhere and then flunked out or nearly, yeah, not really flunked out. No, why? Well, I left it because I was filling out of that class. Oh, but, but yeah, you know, they invested a big chunk of time and a big chunk of dollars into something that ultimately didn't help. Didn't pan out. And so he's really, you know, we're really trying to cure the, I don't know, syndrome of the, of the high schooler and, and really just present other options. And so. Uh, we adopted that, you know, we, we, we'd set an MOU, a Memorandum of Agree, of Understanding, which is a contract with them in 2021, say August or so. And, and since then, uh, as of now, um, we've got, uh, there's seven schools in Northern Colorado that are, that are teaching the curriculum. Okay. Uh, the curriculum is really great. The, the first semester, first thing they do. The curriculum is like. Do I want to be a construction person? No, it's the class. It's a full on shop class, but it's not just building, you know, it's not building birdhouses. It's like framing and plumbing and stuff. So the first thing that the kids learn in this curriculum is, uh, um, is they get an OSHA certificate. Oh, wow. And then based on that, then they go into, you know, a pre apprenticeship math certificate, which then, you know, how to read a tape measure and look at angles on a, you know, on a square and all kinds of things. How do you do math on a job site? Right, right, right. And then depending on the school and what they want to do, you know, there's a couple of schools that we're working with that are more of a shotgun exploratory type. And there's a couple of schools that want to be really, like, we're going to churn out framers. You know, and so from there, the students are allowed to, or the school is allowed to develop the, Their, their coursework through the curriculum and, and the kids earn certificates that are industry recognized across the country. So they'll earn a certificate in plumbing because they pass and it's, it's 75 percent hands on, it's like 25 percent classwork, 75 percent hands on. And then, um, when they earn that certificate, then the school gets reimbursed from the state so it can become a self sufficient program. Yeah. Um, at a public school setting, that's another aside. Well, and so far you got seven schools out of quite a bit more than that, right? Well, I don't know, I don't know how many high schools are in Northern Colorado. My, I mean, my aim is to at least be, have saturation in all the districts. Okay. So that there's an option. Yeah, yeah. Um, Well, if somebody listens to this and, you know, is like, Hey, my kid should know about this, cause They sound like a great fit. Uh, how do they, do they contact the Home Builders Association or something like that? Oh, I would say Guidance Counselor. Oh, sure. I would say get with their Guidance Counselor or their, or their high school CTE. So CTE is Construction Technology Education. It's not really a fair, it's kind of a misnomer because that includes nursing and manufacturing and Uh, construction and, uh, That's like a defined thing coming out of high school. Yeah. It's a whole set of pathways that, that are designed to get the kids to work. And ultimately, you know, the, the thing that, that I love about it is that, and it's so funny because it's just the way the world works. Like the school has no idea how to talk to the industry. Right. Right. And the industry has no idea how to get into the school. Right. And so that's kind of the glue that we're providing as the that conduit. We understand you and you. Yeah. And that, again, my wife being in education, I'm dangerous because I, I know more than I should about how that whole thing operates and I know a lot of people. Um, but, but ultimately, you know, what, what we're able to do and, is get these kids educated, get them job shadows, uh, get them, um, both, uh, whether, whether they're paid or unpaid internships, kind of up to the school, you know, we don't get involved in their politics, their internal build. Um, but what we do is we provide trained kids to the industry and, and, and, and. As of right now, with those seven schools, I think we've got about a hundred, well, that's not true because Roosevelt, and this is a great piece to this too, Roosevelt High School in Johnstown has, I think there's, I think there's 144 kids enrolled in just the construction pathway and there's a wait list. So it's not, it's not the cast off kids. Wow. In fact, two of the kids from Roosevelt got hired by, uh, independent plumbing solutions here in town last summer. Yeah. Uh, do you know Dano? I do. He's a good friend of mine. Yeah, yeah. Good guy. He should be in Loco Think Tank if you're listening. Yeah, I'll talk to him. Just saying. He's a, yeah, we'll, we'll talk to him. He's hard to pin down. Um, but anyhow, we, they hired two kids from Roosevelt. Cool. And, uh, both those kids worked all last summer and are looking to come back this summer. Uh, they were, they were juniors going into their senior year last summer. So now they're. Now they're seniors going into the. Start right up after graduation. And one of those two kids is in the top ten for valedictorian. So it's not, it's not the degenerate kids, it's like legitimate, like, I don't really want to go to college kids and you know, then like, I always, Well, I can, not to interrupt, but for somebody that wants to start a business, frankly, like you'd probably be better off. going to work as a plumber for a plumbing company or as a technician for an HVAC company and then starting your plumbing or HVAC company, then going to get a business degree from CSU. Yeah, what a lot of people don't know or don't, are unwilling to recognize, I guess is a better way to put it, but a lot of people don't recognize that, um, there's a huge age gap. Yeah. In all trades. A whole bunch of old people going away that need to be replaced. You know, average owner age is probably 57. Yeah. And, and, you know, Oh, buy you, buy you a five person, million dollar HVAC company or a million and a half dollar HVAC company and have a great lifestyle for the rest of your life. Well, and that's, that's kind of the thing, like, you know, and not, not that I, it's, there's no regret in this. There's no, it's just a, it's just an observation, but, but truly. You know, if you were to get in, if someone were to get into my ear knowing who I am, and I've been the same person a long time, everybody that knows me will say that, um, I've, I've, I've always known who I am, um, at least starting in about middle of high school, but, um, if someone would have said, Hey, if you really put your head down and go to work and, and learn a trade, You know, by the time you're 25, you could be the project foreman, the superintendent, something to that effect. And by the time you're 30, you could own the company. I probably would have done it. Right. Right. I mean, but you've crafted your own path and this kind of interesting journey that you've had instead, but yeah, but, but similar type of thing, you know, and so, That, that's, that's what we're trying to do is bring that awareness to the students. There is definitely a stigma against the trades, which we're trying to break down. Um, but ultimately the whole, the whole thing is so fantastic because now both of those kids, have you heard of Construction Con? Are you familiar with that? Yeah, yeah. So, Construction Con is put on by the Northern Colorado Sector Partnership, which is a kind of a loose organization. Yeah, yeah, we're part of the manufacturing sector and different things. Yep, nursing or whatever. Um, the construction version, I'm on the, I'm on the board there. I'm a co chair, which, honestly, I don't do anything at all. When's that coming up? Uh, Construction Con was in, uh, was in October. Okay. So it'll be next October. Watch for the next one, yeah. Um, but it's kind of a hands on carnival. That's the way I put it. Like the kids get to go, you know, they get to go drive pavers or they get to do some welding and they like literally get to feel the things that are happening that connect to this education that they're getting. Um, but it also opens up the door to have. You know, this, this year, I want to say, I know there was slotted 700 kids. I don't think all 700 went, but there was over 80 vendors, meaning over 80 employers, you know, talking to exactly, but more of a hands on experimental type of thing that I don't, I don't know that any jobs are actually acquired at that. Sure. Um, but at least it opens their mind to a demo almost. Yeah. Um, But what, what was amazing and you know, I I'll brag, um, and it wasn't really me, but it was our, it was our program. Um, those two kids from Roosevelt were working at the desk. So say those 700 kids went through this deal, right? High school students. And they're all like talking to all these vendors and talking to all these employers, and then they come up on their peers who are working and getting paid. on the other side of the desk at construction con and they're kids that are in our program. It was frigging awesome. I'm sure frigging awesome. So as it sits today, um, we've got seven schools, roughly, yeah, roughly probably 300 kids are in the program in Northern Colorado. The program at a statewide level is about 63 schools and about 3, 800 kids. We've landed over 900 jobs through that program. Um, and it's only growing exponentially and, and without pressure and, and, uh, without trying, um, anymore, I'd say I've tried really hard, but without trying anymore, we could probably add five or six schools for the 24, 25 school year. Um, biggest problem we've got is money, which is always going to be the problem with a non profit type of thing. There's a real passion for you, I can tell. I just want to change the world, Kurt. I don't like it a whole lot. Yeah. Um, do you want to jump into politics from there? Sure. That fits really well. Seems like the tie in is right there. Yeah, it fits really well. What's, uh, what's wrong with the world? Um You know, there's, there's a culture war that a lot of people aren't willing to admit. Um, I, I, I, I am the black sheep of my family. I've, I, they're, they're very liberal. Uh, very, very democratic. Interesting. Democrat. And I don't, I don't fit at all. I'm not, I'm not a diehard Republican. Sure. But I definitely lean conservative in my beliefs. I think that comes from running a small business, owning a small business. Yeah. Well, what I'm sensing is an interesting dichotomy. If you, like you talked about. You know, the Catholic background and different things and whatever, and I guess that was your grandma, not your parents more. No, my, so what's really funny is my Even your mommas came back around, though. My, my, my dad is a diehard atheist. Okay. Interesting. And my mom is super Catholic, so that's always fun to Yeah, yeah. Like to to, but both are very liberal, you know, very, very much so. Yeah. But again, time and place, you know, hawks and doves and all those things Sure. Come into the conversation. Um, so talk to me about this culture war. Well, more like what, where do you see the, the front, let me, let me throw you a different question and we'll go, go to it. When do you, when do you think where we got to started? Like where we are today? Yeah, when do you think it started? You know, probably. 1970 or something, you know, in those, those days. And then, you know, we've been kind of coasting on the values and morals that were part of the culture for a long time, those 10 commandments that you mentioned and stuff like that. And, and now we're losing momentum where. You know, people are filming porn videos in their Senate office. Yep. You know, gay porn videos. And then saying I would never disrespect the office. Right, well. At the same time as disrespecting the office. Did you wipe your cock off with the flag? Yeah. Was that respectful? Yeah. I don't know. So, yeah, so that, no, that, so, so my take is that it's taken Forty ish years, maybe more, because I think that's a fair synopsis. I, I, this has taken 40 or more years to get here. And I, personally, I think it started with the PC thing. Like the political correctness. You know, like, oh, you can't, oh, you can't say that. Well, why not? What was that? What was that First Amendment thing? Right. You know, I was talking to my 11 year old about it last night at dinner, about, about the First Amendment, why it's important. Yeah. Um, so I, I think really the, the, you know, between cancel culture and between, um And that's all pretty recent, though, in comparison. It is, it is, but, but that's why I say, that's where I really think The seeds are planted farther, but yeah. Absolutely, that, but that's why I think we're here now, you know, I, I'm, I'm I'm kind of been chewing through this book for like six months, uh, because it's written, it's written really terribly. The guy, he won't say anything cause he's dead, uh, the wrote the book, but, um, it's, it's called amusing ourselves to death by Neil Postman. I've heard of that book. I haven't read it yet. It's, it's, it's a fascinating story. I mean, it's a, it's, it's, it's so interesting because, um, it tells the history of like when you think of like, and you know, you can go back all time, but you think about like Abraham Lincoln. Sure. And, and in a presidential debate, he and, uh, and, and his, uh, shame on me. My American history is not that great when it comes to political opponents, I don't, whatever. But they would, they would debate for like three or four hours on end. Yeah. And then they would stop and have dinner. And then they would like rebut for another three hours, right? And, and, and people would go in flocks to, to watch and follow this discourse. Yeah. And, and very long, eloquent thoughts. Yeah, the Socratic method kind of in action, right? And then, and then not too far down the road, out comes the telegraph, and out comes the tele The, the photograph. Right. And, and it takes So they can show the stories of these debates kind of beyond and whatever. Well, even, even better than that, and it's the, I'll get to that, but even better than that is, like, now, news that happened in Buffalo. Is relevant to some guy in Texas because they can transport it on a telegraph doesn't matter in Buffalo to the guy in Texas or vice versa, but we can share that information and that's the telegraph and then they combine it with the photograph and turned it into moving pictures and this book is all about, it's fascinating, man, the book is all about how television is degrading culture. Well, for sure. Like I was probably going on a different tangent, but, but maybe it's on the same path, right? Like. Like, 38 percent or something of single 30 something men are not interested in finding a woman right now. No, well Uh, because they got free porn and a sex doll and, like, they're amusing themselves to death. And, and, well, so that's a, that's an excellent Like it's expansion of next step, but this book was written in 1984. Oh, yeah. So I had no idea what the internet was. Right. Right. It was about how television is ruining the world. Right. Right. Not like, not even a. com. Well, yeah. And so now when we take it to that, like, I mean, there's so many people that are just like so much of our economy, even like the NFL, you know, that's frankly us amusing ourselves to death. It's just entertainment. It doesn't provide anybody any food, no shelter, no real value add to your world. You know, it's not even really a tourist destination, I guess. I mean, you can buy jerseys and stuff, and it's cool, but Well, it's all designed to distract you. It's all designed to keep you not paying attention to what's happening. Um, and so that's Which is what's really happening. Do we know? I don't know, I mean, I think there's a big, sinister, yucky thing. You know, I, I, I always, I, I A globular power concentration. We could do this for another two hours, which I don't have. But, you know, I don't, I don't know that I believe in, like, a super villain, although No, I don't think so. Although Elon Musk did just come out and say that dude in Germany is a super villain, like, this week. Oh, the Soros guy? No, the other one. Oh, the World Economic Forum guy. Yeah. Oh, interesting. Uh, what's his name? No, Schwab, Klaus Schwab. Yeah, like literally I saw that on Twitter the other day, Twitter, whatever. I mean, he's probably a super villain, but that being said, I don't, I don't know that I fully, I don't know that I fully buy, yeah, there's not like some centralized, a cabal. Yeah, the Jews aren't controlling this all. No, I don't, I don't buy that. But that being said, you know, you look at that, I mean, that's, that's, part of the reason I picked that book up is because it's like, wow, this book was written in 1984, and, and the guy had no clue of what has happened over the last 30 years, 40 years. Right, right. But that being said, he, he was onto something. Like, you could literally take Text off a one page from 1984 and appointed to 2023 and he's spot on. I would, uh, encourage you at some point, if you're interested in both philosophy and you don't want to sprinkle a little religion into it too, or a little faith. C. S. Lewis was so fucking far ahead of the curve, so many of his books and stuff like that. Uh, just. Same with, same with Orwell and Huxley, and Ayn Rand, uh, it's, that, that goes into this book, like, he thinks there were more, and, and again, That awareness of totalitarianism, and the, the, the inclination to be authoritarian. He, he debates to himself in this book, and, and, and it, it like, every sentence is, In other words, or having said, I mean, it is really hard to read. It's like hype. It's like pseudo intellectual written. What's the name of it again? It's called Amusing Ourselves to Death. Okay. But he definitely does, he definitely does put into context that we're much more towards a brave new world than we are in 1984. Correct, yep. But I, I think, I think it's a really good combination of all of them. If you look at Uh, Lonely Hipster, my friend Aaron, Aaron Everett, he's, there's a third book in there. Yeah. That's, I can't quite remember where he's bending it, but it's more about the pleasure element. Yeah. Like, neither The Brave New World nor 1984. Yeah. But it's more like the Amusing Ourselves to Death, but there's a more modern book that ties that in. Do you remember the movie WALL E? It was a Disney movie before they went woke. Yes. About the robot. Yes. What's that movie really about? Do you remember? Uh, self control, uh, in some ways, or, or So, so that movie was, the, the, the basic, the basic overview of that movie is that we killed the planet, and we're out living on this spaceship, and this robot is searching for life on the planet. Okay. Any kind of life, like a spring of, of a, of a leaf or something. But at the meantime, all the humans are up on this big super spaceship, just literally fat as they can be on, on like hover chairs, going on vacation on virtual reality. Right, right. We're well on our way there already. Oh, sure. That movie was well ahead of its time, but it's really about the sloth of humans as opposed to we killed the planet. The uselessness of us when we get to that point. Yeah. Like we'd be better off as hunter gatherers than rich people with Facebook fighting about who should be the next president. There's, there's, Who should be the next president while we're here. It's, uh, I think, you know, Nikki Haley might win, she won't win New Hampshire tonight, but I don't, I really don't like her. I think, I think she's, she's Obama esque, honestly. Yeah, a hundred percent. Yeah, with, without, without saying much more than that. I, you know, I'm not a diehard Trumper. Um, although. And I'll say, although, I, I, if he would've, if he would've been a little more quiet and just done what he did, I think he would've been alright. Yeah. But that being said, the powers that be really didn't like him. That's the thing I like the most about him. Yeah. Kinda is that all the powers that be don't like him so much. Yeah, well that should tell you something, right? Totally. That should tell you something. And so, you know, the powers that, you know, back to that amusing yourselves to death, everything's produced. Right, right. Everything's produced. Yeah. And he tore up the script. And they're like, well, fuck you. You can't tear up our script. You're going down, sucker. Yeah. How about RFK? You know, I like him. He's I think he's going to get more than 20%. I bet Mike O'Connell 20 bucks the other day that he would get more than 20%. I think that's a fair bet. Here's the problem. If he doesn't get assassinated first, just, you know, that could happen. You can't You used to not be able to say that, remember? No, I just say shit like that. You didn't say, I'm going to kill the president. Everybody knows the CIA killed his uncle and his dad. I mean, whatever. You can't say, you can't say, I'm going to kill the president, but you can say he's going to be, that's something that, The CIA will probably have him killed. Whatever happened to assassinations, man? Like, just in general. Um, I, you know, you know, DeSantis watched, checked out, what, yesterday? Yep. Um, the Republican Party's not great. I like, I like Vivek. I do too. Um, he's Did you see the joke about, uh, Trump, uh, giving him a position in the administration as the head of the White House 7 Eleven? No. So many people got their panties in a bunch, including some supposedly conservative, right? And then, well, and then it like blossomed and Vivek was sharing all these like slurpy jokes and things like that. Oh yeah. No, I like him. You can't hurt my feelings. Like, I'm not as, you know, I know there's a stereotype about Indian people in 7 Eleven. It's like, I get it. He might, he might be too much, but I, I really like his takes. The powers that be don't, don't like him. So that's another thing. Always, always. I'm always, I, I call it an underdog or a, you know, a dark horse, you know, I read an article, nothing about his skin color. I'm just saying he's a dark horse. Yeah. Yeah. You got to be careful with that. Don't get canceled, Kurt. So I read an article years ago. God, I don't even remember. So Osama bin Laden was still alive. So when, when do we get him? Oh, nine. Oh, eight. No, nine, something like that. So, but it was, it was an article written. In the context of Star Wars. Okay. But it was all today's news. Hmm. Who, who's the empire, right? Who's the empire in that Senate in that scenario? I'm sure. And who's the rebel force. I'm pretty sure whoever tells Joe Biden what to do is the empire. Fair, right. Maybe it's Barack Obama, but if that's a council of people, I don't know. If it's that parallel universe, right. If it's that, if it's that parallel, so yeah. Who's the rebel forces? Well, that's Osama Bin Laden and his crew, right? Right, right. It was mind blowing, like, holy shit, this is round. Are we the baddies? Yeah. And there was all these people like, yeah, my kid's on the S. S. I don't even know what they call them on Star Wars. Right, right. My kid's on the S. S. Enterprise or whatever, and it's like, holy shit, we're the Empire. Right. Wow! What happened? Right, well, we, like, invaded Iraq, killed two million people. They didn't have weapons of mass destruction. Yeah. Oops. Whoops, my bad. Sorry. Uh, yeah, so, yeah, we can both have, uh, disdain for, uh, the way we've run this country for the last Well, and that's part of what I like about Trump. He didn't, no new wars. Abraham Accords, you know, he blew us into a shit ton of debt, you know, that's kind of dumb, whatever. Yeah, but I, I personally had the best four fiscal years of my life between 2016 and 2020. Really? Yeah. Yeah. That's real. And the last, you know, the last three years have been difficult. It made, we've made money. We've been okay. We're not starving. Yeah. Yeah. But it, but you can definitely feel the, the inadvertent or advertent tax. Well, yeah. Fair. There's a lot. I mean, we're spending a lot on that green new deal stuff and all of the. They're trying really hard to spend your money. The Inflation Reduction Act, which was the most ironic named bill in the history of all bills in the world. Was that, what do they call it in, in, uh, in 1984 is, uh, is, uh, Think Speak? No, the other one. Um, Double Speak. Double, yeah, Double, Double Think. Double Think. Yeah, that's what it is. It's like, oh, I gotta, no, no, no, yeah, no, that's right, no, yeah, that's right. Um, we're gonna drift off. back to your family before we get in trouble in this political room. No, cause we will. I'll go all night. What was it, uh, about this girl that kept coming to the clubs and stuff? I mean, you had, uh, it sounds like a lot of girlfriends during your days along the way. Yeah. Um. But this was maybe the, was this the first serious one? No, not really. Um, yeah, you know, buddy, the, um, God, it sounds lame. I, uh, I needed a place to crash after your roommates kicked you out. No, it was, it was more than that. And it's so funny. So I'll say I've had, I've had a couple of stalkers in my life, which sounds crazy. Cause I'm not that good looking. Um, but I've had a couple of stalkers. Some women are crazy. That's also true. Yeah. Yeah. I think we'll say some, some, you could say most. Um, so I, I remember, I remember vividly when I was working for Valley Nissan, Subaru and Longmont, and that was in 2005. I had a phone call from a girl that I knew from high school, never, I didn't really date, but we used to hang out. Okay. Um, I dated her friend, but we used to hang out and she called me at the dealership. I hadn't talked to her in eight years probably. And she called me at the dealership and it was like, where did you come from? Right. Find me. You heard I was starting to make some money in car sales. Before this is before the real, I mean, this is the internet 2. 0 kind of right? Like there's no Facebook, just kind of my space, but she found me and I was talking to her and, and I, and she's, she's like, well, how's it going? And I talked to her. I didn't, I didn't dodge her. But I was like, oh yeah, I'm engaged to my wife and, you know, engaged in my. Girlfriend, fiance, who she knew and she's like, well, how did that happen? It just happened, you know? So then I'd tell one of my two buddies that I, I grew up with, you know, that we lived in and we rich together. And he was like, everybody knew it was going to happen. Just a matter of time. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so I can say when she, God, she's gonna, I hope she never listens to this. She might, um, When she came back to the high school, when she came to our high school, the Manitou, um, she was friends with all my friends, but we were never really close. I mean, we, we used to hang out when we were seniors, because we both had AP classes at the, at the Community College of Pikes Peak, where, you know, we would have a morning class at the high school and an afternoon class at the high school. Catch a bus down the hill for Well, we both had cars, so we would drive down, you know, but It was, we would have that schedule all week, but we'd only have class on Tuesday and Thursday. And so we started hanging out, like we'd go to the mall, and they would think we were skipping school and kick us out of the mall, like we'd go get a Cinna Monster, you know? Like, get out of the mall, kids, you know? So, it didn't really click until Honestly, like, I, I was aware of her, um, I, I, she'll say she wasn't aware of me, that's fine, but, I was aware of her, and, and how, you know, she used to come to all the parties that we threw, so her mom worked in law enforcement in the Springs, and, Not be, that wasn't how she came to the parties, No, she, She just wanted somebody that would, Do they give you a heads up if they're gonna get busted? No, not even that, not even that. She just wanted to hang out with us, you know. So we'd throw a party and, and she would come. But she wouldn't, she wouldn't drink. She wouldn't, you know, she would just come be goody goody and hang, just hang out. And so we taught her how to pour a beer out of the keg. Sure. In high school. Nice to have a good keg girl. Uh, and we made her like a, a, a name tag that said beer princess on it, you know. She had big knockers and it's always best to have a keg girl with big knockers. I'm just saying, I'm just asking. None of my business. We'll keep going. You can, you can beat her and decide for yourself. I'm going to plead the fifth. Uh, but anyway, so he used to, he used to hang out and uh, and, and, and I remember when we went to like, um, like orientation night at the, at the community college. She was sitting a little ways away and I was like, oh, there's that girl from school. What's her, you know, and it just kind of clicked in and, and I don't know. I, I, it wasn't that moment was like. That's my girl. I, I had an attraction from that moment and everyone knew it. I guess she didn't until she did. And then here we are, you know, so that was, so that was like 97 and we got married in Oh five, we moved in together and Oh two. So on paper, we've got 18 years, a lot longer than that together. I don't know. What's her favorite thing about you? Uh, other than your, no, nothing. Um, she, she, would she say that I'm this position? She would say that I'm very generous. Okay. She would say that I like it. Um, I don't, I That might just be her saying that Right. It's her perspective. Whatever, No, I am, I, I try that. I, I try really hard. It's not. you know, can't take it with me. Uh, I, you know, I, I, I'm a firm believer in the, um, you know, the oxygen mask situation on the plane. You got to get yourself situated, but then you got to help the person next to you. Um, and that, that kind of drives back to being part of the community and trying to try to actually bless others is kind of your right response. Yeah. That was trying to give back, you know, part of my, and maybe you'll resonate with this, maybe not, but my own faith journey. I, I, Didn't, I went to a church but didn't really hear the good news, so to speak, for a long time as a kid. Yeah. Um, and then I had like a lot of guilt. Like I was smart. I was, I became tall after growing up in high school. Like a, like the shortest kid. Yeah. Yeah. I grew, I grew, I grew in senior year. I wasn't very tall. I was super short and stuff and, and whatever. And, you know. Even though we were, like, poor and stuff, I just felt, like, over blessed compared to the number of my sinful tendencies, if you will. Or whatever, and so, but ultimately, as I drifted into faith, it was like, well, if that's the case, if you've been blessed, Over and above the average for humanity. Well, then that means you should give back more over and above to humanity. I don't need all that. And you know, I don't, I don't need, I don't need the, uh, I mean, I believe me. I was, my parents will confirm this since I was a small kid. I've always said I wanted an Island. Um, the older I get, the more metaphorical that gets right. Just to try and be insulated from whatever happens. But, um. No, I, you know, We could build a trade school on Epstein Island. That'd be cool. That would be cool, except for there's probably a lot of ghosts there. Yeah, alright. A lot of ghosts there. We'll pull away from that. Um, but, uh, yeah, no, I, I, I just, you know, I, I would say that's what she would say. Um, is that I'm, that I'm generous and I, and I, and I, I try really hard. Yeah. I just, well, I, Show up. Yeah. Whether it's at work or at home. Yeah. Um, let's talk about these kids you got. You got two of them? Yep. Um, we tend to do a one word description of the children. Okay. Uh, can you do that for your, and give me their name, repeat their name again for me. So, Owen is the boy. He's the older one? Yeah, he's eleven. And, uh, Uh, he's passionate. I would, uh, that's a word I would use for him. That, that, that, that bleeds into emotion and anger and all the things. Frustration and all those things. And perfection. Ultimately, it's a candle that powers the flame. Yeah, he's very passionate about what he, what he is and who he wants to be. And, you know, he's a very good team player. You know, I, every day, both of them, when I drop them off for school, Uh, I tell them to be a leader. You know, whatever that means to them. Yeah. And make it a good day. And, uh, He takes that, he takes that to heart. I dig it. Um, the eight year old is trouble. God, she is gonna be That's her one word? Yeah. What's her name? Her name is Ellery. Ellery? Ellery, E L L O R Y. Is that a family name? No, we made it up. Oh. And turns out there's a kid in Owen's class that's named Ellery, so No shit. I don't know that we made it up, we might have just heard it. Um, but uh, you know, she, God, you know I, I, I'm going to sound like a dad, which is so weird to hear you say, you know, hear yourself say, but she is, um, she is like movie star gorgeous and, and she is by far the smartest person in our house, which is a horrible combination, right? She is trouble. Have you seen the Hot Crazy Matrix? Yeah, oh, she fits, like, I don't know, she's not a dude. I'll tell you that. She's not a dude, but man, she is. She might be a unicorn, let's pray she's a unicorn. She is just, man, she is just trouble. She's way smarter than her own good. And, and she knows, she knows that she's adorable. Yeah, you know. I've met a couple people like that in my life, uh, and, you know, it would be good for her to get a good little humility taste, perhaps, in the next few years before she gets a little too powerful. We've realized Like a wizard with too many powers already. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. When you're a blossoming young lady, especially, right? Like, that's dangerous to her and to the society. We've seen it, we've seen it a lot recently, you know, like this semester at school, she's in second grade, second grade. Like, um Um, and, and, you know, there's different, there's different games that boys play versus girls, right? And, and, and not, not, not like crisscross or, or, you know, like wall ball, but like mental, like guys will just kick the shit out of the games now because I was playing in North Dakota 30 years ago. It also kind of depends on, are you really a boy or a girl? And I was never very hot. But, but, you know, guys, guys will just kind of beat the shit out of each other and then become friends, you know? Yeah. And girls are so much more destructive. I mean, even, even at eight years old, they just tear each other apart. I was just talking about that, about how much more cruel on the average females are than males, especially in youth. Yeah. It's, it's amazing. Just like the stories we're hearing, like, man, that little girls. You know? Like, I don't, man, I don't know. I'm thinking Judo. Well Uh, or Jiu Jitsu, rather. Jiu Jitsu. I think she'll fend for her own without it, to be honest. You know what's funny? The power of her personality. Watching her at the, like, at the park playing with other kids, she'll, like, run half speed and outrun everybody. They're both incredible athletes. You gotta grow into it. They're still awkward and young. But man, you can see her and you can almost see her gears turning like, I'm playing with this kid. Like, she'll literally like perfect form but half speed. You know if she wants to turn it on, she'll take off. But she doesn't want to turn it on. She wants to just be out of reach. She's trouble. That's the word I would use. And I've been saying she's a monster since the day she came out. She'll probably listen to this. So, you know, that's fine. I'd tell her, I'd tell her, you know, and my wife always tells me, don't say that. I'm like, she's, she's a problem. Well, maybe she'll try to prove you wrong. Oh, I'd love, I'd love to be proven wrong on this. I would love that. Nothing more than anything. Um, your loco experience, uh, the craziest story or exchange or moment that you would like to share. So I thought long and hard about this. So Um, there's lots, we all have lots of crazy stories, but I'll, I'll use, so this, this will kind of define who we were as kids. Um, so graduation is Saturday. So go back to Thursday, right? It's the last full day of school. A high school graduation. Well, I didn't graduate college. Right. So high school graduation, um, there was a tradition of, The juniors going into their senior year at the high school would go park in the senior parking, right? Oh, right. And the seniors would get like the cheapest soap you could get like 20 cents a bar soap from like Walgreens or whatever And then rub the windows so dark with the soap that you couldn't see out of them Okay, right you call it soap in the windows and then because it was this cheap ass soap It was really hard to get off on the juniors as far as juniors as cars parked in my parking spot Okay, we didn't have to be at school at the same time We're two days away from graduation So we all you know, we all go follow the tradition and we go soap all these juniors windows and we get caught Uh, and we wind up with detention. I never got into detention. I got in a lot of trouble, but I never got in trouble. I was really good at getting out of it. Um, so we all got detention. There was about six of us that got detention, which was going to happen the next day, the last day of school. Okay. So, but it's a half day, but they're not holding detention until like three o'clock. Oh, right. It's a half day for us. Everybody else has to go to school for the whole day. So we got to leave and come back. Right. So that night Um, that Thursday night, the Thursday, the Thursday night we did like, uh, it was called a baccalaureate. I think is the right word where you just kind of like singers saying and dancers dance and people read poems and just kind of remember high school. And we got up and did a, uh, like a lip sync to, um, California dreaming by the mamas and the papas. I like it. There's a whole thing. Yeah. Um, so we did that. And then that night was a, was also a tradition, was a scavenger hunt. After detention? After, no. Detention's tomorrow. Thursday, right, okay. Okay? So the scavenger hunt, all the seniors would get together, and there's this list of shit you gotta go get, and it's like, golf flags and all kinds of stuff, right? Right, right. That, you know, uh. From like your small town of Manitou? Yeah, oh yeah. Okay. And so, like a shopping cart from Safeway, and all kinds of stuff. And so we all, we all, you know, dispersed, and uh, my girlfriend at the time had a brother that was a freshman. And one of us went and got, it wasn't me. One of the other guys went to get him cause she was with us. So they went, he, she, and he went with to go get her little brother. Cause she was supposed to be in charge of him and we're out stealing signs and whatever, starting dumpsters on fire. And, uh, probably not part of this. No, we, we weren't actually, we weren't, we weren't vandalists. We just, yeah. I mean, it's still vandalist, but so, so I'm, I used to get. We, my, my one best friend that went to the Coast Guard and I got really good at taking signs down. Oh, yeah. Like we had a, uh, an electric golf cart that silent, right? Right, right. We had a wrench in the dash and we could and be gone in 20 seconds. So I'm taking this sign down and, uh, up, up pulls the cops and I'm like, I'm fixing this sign. I'm like, you're welcome. I'm like taking this sign down, down and, uh, He comes up and he's like, what are you doing? I'm like, not feeling good. You know, I'm pretending like I'm not feeling good. So they haul us in. And uh, I was 18 and the, my buddy that I was with was not, he was 17. And so they called, they called his parents and said, Hey, you gotta come get them. And they asked me if I want to talk to my parents. Like, no, I'll deal with this. And so I did. And I negotiated that we would have. All the things returned. Every single thing. All the golf flags, all the Everything that was taken. I said, we'll have it all back by 9 o'clock tomorrow morning. Right? I'm like, you don't need to call my parents. I just need the time to go do it. I just, let me, I'll put it all back. We didn't do anything that bad, you know? And so At the same time, one of the other crews of scavenger hunters had gone and defaced balanced rock at Garden of the Gods. Uh oh. Like spray painted it and, and hooked it up and, and, Was that in the scavenger hunt? That was extra credit. It was extra credit. Okay. Wasn't us, but I, I, I know who it is, but I, I will never tell cause you know, snitches and stitches and things. Right, right. But um, Bitches get stitches. Yeah. So, so I negotiated that, but they were grinding on me. Like, tell us who did this. I'm like, I'm here. How the hell do I know. Yeah. So, so we did, we put everything back, and so, we put everything back by the next morning and, and like, nobody got in trouble. Just like that? Just, just, kinda just, kinda disappeared. So then we go to graduation practice, right? And then we gotta go home. And, cause then we gotta come back for detention. Right, right. At three o'clock. And so, as we're driving home, my buddy's driving. And we're in, we're in Greenmount Falls, Cascade, Chapita Park, where I grew up. And we're coming down the hill by the elementary school there, by U Pass Elementary. And there's an emu. Like a Oh, like an ostrich? That's what I said! I said a motherfucking ostrich! I'm like, holy shit! Why is there an ostrich in Greenmount Falls? You know, I played baseball, as we talked about, so I got a bag of baseballs. I'm like, hey, let's throw some baseballs at it, you know, try and chase it. So we start chucking baseballs at it and I'm like, Hey, I got an idea. I'm like, okay, we're going to get to my house. We're going to split up. I'm going to call my buddy. That's got a truck. You guys are going to go get a camera. We're going to catch this thing. Right. So take it back to the Cheyenne mountain zoo. So, well, I was, this, this would give a little capitalist idea who I've always been to. So we, you know, so there's somewhere, and I don't know, someone's got it. I don't know who has it. There's a film of me with a rope. You're going to lasso this emu. Lassoing an emu. Actually successfully lassoing it? Kinda. I mean, I got him. I got him. And, uh. It wasn't like a pure real life nightmare. No, no, no. So I lassoed him and I'm like, you know what we should do? We didn't do a good senior prank. We should let him loose at the school. Oh shit. Right? So we throw them in the back, we like grab them and like, yeah, before detention, I'm supposed to be there in a couple hours. So, so we throw them in the back of this truck and we roll down to the school and I roll into the school and this, this was who I always was. Like I'd walk in and go, listen, I can't, I can't do detention because, or I, I, here's what really happened. And I tell some story. So I, I walk into the office and I go, listen, I can't do detention today. And they're like, what? Well, why not? And I go, well, cause I got an ostrich in the truck and they're like, no, you don't. I'm like, come look at it, call me on it. So next thing you know, all 400 kids in the school are out back looking at this emu in the back of this truck. I'm supposed to be in detention. And, uh, Uh, we never let him lose cause we figured out it was probably a federal crime or at least a state crime to let him lose. So then in my mind, I'm like, all right, so we caught this thing. He had to be cut. He had to come from somewhere. Right. I'm like, he, he came from somewhere. We gotta be able to get money for this thing. Right. So we, you know, we start making phone calls and my buddy's mom's like, well, it escaped from this place over. So I'm like, all right, let's roll this. Let's roll this ostrich over to this guy's house and see if he'll take some money for it. Maybe it's got some eggs, I don't know, you know, so So we roll over, this dude's pissed, cause his, the emu's legs were all tore up from the rope that we binded it with. We had a tarp over its head, and it, yeah, it was Yeah, that was a pretty crazy 24 hours. He didn't say thank you for bringing my emu back. Here's a bunch of money. He was pretty mad. He's like, you're lucky I don't sue you for fucking harming my emu. Shouldn't have let your emu loose, sir. Which I was prepared to say. So yeah, that was a pretty good 24 hours. I dig it, I dig it. Um, any last words? No, man, this was really fun. It was fun. Yeah, this was really fun. Uh, well. Talk real soon, and if you're out there looking for a car, looking for a lease, please come see us, and look into the, uh, look into the Onoko HBA. Oh, but just one more, yeah, one more other thing. Uh, this is words that I never thought would come out of my mouth. Um, I'm about to be the founder of a 501c3. Oh! Uh, which is involved in the W in the workforce development. Um, we're getting to the point where we need to collect more funds than we can find. And so we've got to go out to the community. So if anybody's interested in helping us fund it, I'll have them look up. Yeah. Please. Ian Simkiss, S I M K I S S right at Centennial Auto Brokers. Centennial Auto Leasing and Sales of Northern Colorado. Yes. Yep. This was fun. Thanks Kurt. See you next time.